General Discussion

[Ogami]

Force the player to use at least 1-2 AP points before he can press "Next Day".   Even if he just talks to a girl or something like that it would
cost the player time and prevent  "Next Day" Button Spamming.
Maybe with a popup window like " You are still feeling full of energy today. Maybe you should go out and do something?"
You also could make it mandatory to spend all AP before you can proceed to the next day.
But then you have to remove the AP requierments for the MC regarding healing and coming to the aid of attacked girls.
I always thought the MC should just automaticaly defend girls in the house where he lives at the moment, regardless of AP.
If you want to force the player to employ guards you could make the agressive customers stronger or attack in groups later.

[Pinkutako]

Are you basing those stats increases/decreases on Next Day report or actually checking MC profile screen?

Actual MC stat changes.  It is actually a bit of an exploit to quickly gain constitution and charisma. It only occurs if the training effects those stats. It take a little save scumming to get the constitution increase, because of the rarity of training increase for that stat.

[DarkTl]

Right, first of all force to spend at least 1-2 AP before next day.
Maybe add a negative effect if MC doesn't leaving the brothel (or house) for a prolonged period, like claustrophobia or something. Or decrease fame over time for example, hermits are usually not popular.

In the future I'd like to have global goals that have nothing to do with pure amount of money, and that will become only more difficult if you wait too long. Thus, feel free to save up some money if you want, it's not like they will help you with everything 

[Marquis]

I had posted this in the ST thread, but may have been missed.
Here are some rambling thoughts on types of girls sparked by 'why would you have both slaves and free girls?' Each should have some advantages and disadvantages.
I included a cap to brothel reputation for some girl types - e.g. even if slavery is technically legal, the reputation of a brothel might take a hit for having slaves. This would be no problem for the shack, but would limit the mansion.


Captured/Coerced girls - captured monster girls or adventurers in catacombs or elsewhere, maybe kidnapping free girls. Disobedient.   
   Cost to acquire - few APs
   Jobs- Only usable for jobs when coerced (e.g. chains/collar). No pay.
        Advantages - Free. May be sold for a small amount of gold. Raw material for slave training. Can be a rare type (monster girls) or exceptional stats.
        Disadvantages - Requires constant supervision/dungeon. Zero Joy/Disposition. Limits reputation of brothel and affects other girls' disposition towards MC.


Bought Slaves - bought at slave market. Obedient.
   Cost to acquire - gold (equivalent to about 100APs in the beginning).
   Jobs- Basic jobs. No pay.
   Advantages- Easy to manage. Will do any job. Giving optional payment or attention can improve joy/disposition to a point.
   Disadvantage- Limit to Disposition/Joy maximum (maybe 50%). Low to Average stats. Limits brothel reputation maximum.


Free girls - become employees. Disposition is important for obedience.
   Cost to acquire - APs/gold. Should only require a few APs for their 'desired' job, but lots of APs/gold to increase disposition for undesired jobs.
   Jobs- only the ones they want to do. Fair pay. Maybe they can be convinced to enter slave training voluntarily (exceptionally high disposition? supporting an addiction?)
   Advantages- Better girls (higher stats). No limit to joy/disposition. No limit to brothel reputation.
   Disadvantages- requires fair payment (lower profits).


Trained slaves - either a free girl or captured girl trained to be fully obedient
   Cost to acquire - many APs to convince a free girl to enter training. No cost for captured girls. Many APs to actually conduct training.
   Jobs - No pay. Unique jobs available (ponygirl/catgirl).
   Advantages - Can train a higher stat girl than usual for some jobs. No limit to brothel reputation. Can be sold (but probably not cost effective due to high APs required).
   Disadvantages - Time to train.


Low level brothel: trained or bought slaves and coerced girls as prostitutes
Medium level brothel: free girls in some jobs (service/stripper, rarely prostitute), trained or bought slaves as prostitutes (or stripper/service)
High level brothel: free girls and trained slaves in all jobs

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[Marquis]

As for hitting 'next day' as an exploit. Why worry about it? If a player wants to play that way, let them. I think it's pretty boring to do that. If you just want some extra cash, it's easy to edit the files to start with tons of cash. While useful for testing the range of the game that's no fun to play (for many of us). If someone wants a lot of cash to do something else they want to have fun doing, let them. 

[DarkTl]

^ Because the game should not be easy, unless you picked an easy mode.

[Xela]

I had posted this in the ST thread, but may have been missed.
Here are some rambling thoughts on types of girls sparked by 'why would you have both slaves and free girls?' Each should have some advantages and disadvantages.
I included a cap to brothel reputation for some girl types - e.g. even if slavery is technically legal, the reputation of a brothel might take a hit for having slaves. This would be no problem for the shack, but would limit the mansion.


Captured/Coerced girls - captured monster girls or adventurers in catacombs or elsewhere, maybe kidnapping free girls. Disobedient.   
   Cost to acquire - few APs
   Jobs- Only usable for jobs when coerced (e.g. chains/collar). No pay.
        Advantages - Free. May be sold for a small amount of gold. Raw material for slave training. Can be a rare type (monster girls) or exceptional stats.
        Disadvantages - Requires constant supervision/dungeon. Zero Joy/Disposition. Limits reputation of brothel and affects other girls' disposition towards MC.

ST/Exploration would be required unless we take shortcuts. Also I am not really in favor of brothel reputation being capped just from slaves working there. It's very different from limiting ranks. Maybe limiting reputation/fame of slave girls and through that the effectiveness of their influence on brothel fame/reputation but it's a confusing chain of logic.

Bought Slaves - bought at slave market. Obedient.
   Cost to acquire - gold (equivalent to about 100APs in the beginning).
   Jobs- Basic jobs. No pay.
   Advantages- Easy to manage. Will do any job. Giving optional payment or attention can improve joy/disposition to a point.
   Disadvantage- Limit to Disposition/Joy maximum (maybe 50%). Low to Average stats. Limits brothel reputation maximum.

Stockholm syndrom and etc. I am not in favor limiting Disposition/Joy for slaves either, maybe only slaves with specific traits.Same with stats, maybe we can do something like: very high intelligence stat + specific traits = high chance to rebel or something but simulations like that are in the distant future.

Free girls - become employees. Disposition is important for obedience.
   Cost to acquire - APs/gold. Should only require a few APs for their 'desired' job, but lots of APs/gold to increase disposition for undesired jobs.
   Jobs- only the ones they want to do. Fair pay. Maybe they can be convinced to enter slave training voluntarily (exceptionally high disposition? supporting an addiction?)
   Advantages- Better girls (higher stats). No limit to joy/disposition. No limit to brothel reputation.
   Disadvantages- requires fair payment (lower profits).

Yeap, this is what we're working towards. AP cost to acquire will be 1 if girl puts herself in employment agency in the future or girlsmeets sequences otherwise (she has a job elsewhere already and will work for you only if she believes it's a much better bet. You can't really expect 200+ girls in the game being unemployed waiting to work for the MC ). This will improve as game logic develops and amount of content is growing.

Trained slaves - either a free girl or captured girl trained to be fully obedient
   Cost to acquire - many APs to convince a free girl to enter training. No cost for captured girls. Many APs to actually conduct training.
   Jobs - No pay. Unique jobs available (ponygirl/catgirl).
   Advantages - Can train a higher stat girl than usual for some jobs. No limit to brothel reputation. Can be sold (but probably not cost effective due to high APs required).
   Disadvantages - Time to train.

ST basically + specialized content (pony/cat) that I wanted to be as scripted addons for specific girls that have enough pics. Again, ST module will cover this

Low level brothel: trained or bought slaves and coerced girls as prostitutes
Medium level brothel: free girls in some jobs (service/stripper, rarely prostitute), trained or bought slaves as prostitutes (or stripper/service)
High level brothel: free girls and trained slaves in all jobs

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This should be for the player to decide.

As for hitting 'next day' as an exploit. Why worry about it? If a player wants to play that way, let them. I think it's pretty boring to do that. If you just want some extra cash, it's easy to edit the files to start with tons of cash. While useful for testing the range of the game that's no fun to play (for many of us). If someone wants a lot of cash to do something else they want to have fun doing, let them. 

There is difference between cheating and using exploits. If possible I'd like to remove as many exploits as possible. For example in older versions of Civ5 I've always used barbarians smashing sold resources exploit but never considered that cheating. In latest version it was removed for good.

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Right, first of all force to spend at least 1-2 AP before next day.
Maybe add a negative effect if MC doesn't leaving the brothel (or house) for a prolonged period, like claustrophobia or something. Or decrease fame over time for example, hermits are usually not popular.

In the future I'd like to have global goals that have nothing to do with pure amount of money, and that will become only more difficult if you wait too long. Thus, feel free to save up some money if you want, it's not like they will help you with everything 

Forcing spending APs is not the best idea since right now AP = More health/Fatigue/MP recovery.

Negative effect is a decent bet... but that is too poor of a penalty with current amount of content.

Yeah, we'll get to the goals after game has better balance and ST/Exploration are at least at their Alpha stages. Those will be a part of Quests+Tasks+Achievements module.

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Actual MC stat changes.  It is actually a bit of an exploit to quickly gain constitution and charisma. It only occurs if the training effects those stats. It take a little save scumming to get the constitution increase, because of the rarity of training increase for that stat.

Like I've said, I cannot fix something that I cannot replicate. There is an off chance that it's been fixed in the dev version or otherwise I need to know exactly which items are equipped and what stats MC got. I've tried equipping a number of items but it never worked like that. Stats system is definitely advanced enough to be buggy so I am not ruling the possibility of this bug out. I just don't know what to do about it as there is no way for me to know what's wrong and where.

[Xela]

Actual MC stat changes.  It is actually a bit of an exploit to quickly gain constitution and charisma. It only occurs if the training effects those stats. It take a little save scumming to get the constitution increase, because of the rarity of training increase for that stat.

By the way, are you using the latest patch as it was specified in the front thread of Alpha release section or the latest patch that got lost in the posts. I've just updated the front post just in case... I believe that actual latest patch was the one where I rewrote stats system completely.

[tjn67]

I've been searching the forum but for the life of me, I cannot figure out how I get guards.  Any clues to this?

Thanks!

[Xela]

I've been searching the forum but for the life of me, I cannot figure out how I get guards.  Any clues to this?

Thanks!

You need to go through girlsmeets with a Warrior type (In the city), once she knows you well enough (might take a while of talking/giving gifts), she'll agree to work for you (as a guard or teammate for combat in the arena).

[Algernon]

Just wanted to toss an idea your way.

In order to address the Next Day exploit, why not tweak the chances for customers to attack the girls?  Also, you can tweak the damage that is taken during those events.  Then, you could have those values change, based on difficulty level (when implemented).

This way, if someone tried the Next Day exploit on the harder difficulties, they will soon find themselves bankrupt due to the fact that their girls are all spending their time resting from their wounds.  Of course, someone playing on the easy difficulty would be able to use the exploit, but normal and hard difficulties would only be able to use Next Day for about a week.

You would also have a decent money sink in healing potions, on the harder difficulties.

[tjn67]

You need to go through girlsmeets with a Warrior type (In the city), once she knows you well enough (might take a while of talking/giving gifts), she'll agree to work for you (as a guard or teammate for combat in the arena).

Thanks!  (And inadvertently, that's exactly what I ended up doing last night. LOL)

[Xela]

Just wanted to toss an idea your way.

In order to address the Next Day exploit, why not tweak the chances for customers to attack the girls?  Also, you can tweak the damage that is taken during those events.  Then, you could have those values change, based on difficulty level (when implemented).

This way, if someone tried the Next Day exploit on the harder difficulties, they will soon find themselves bankrupt due to the fact that their girls are all spending their time resting from their wounds.  Of course, someone playing on the easy difficulty would be able to use the exploit, but normal and hard difficulties would only be able to use Next Day for about a week.

You would also have a decent money sink in healing potions, on the harder difficulties.

I'd prefer to keep warfare outside of brothel

[Algernon]

I'd prefer to keep warfare outside of brothel

I do agree, but does this mean you are doing away with the Guard job?  All I'm suggesting is to tweak the frequency of existing events.

But, I do see your point.  This is a brothel sim, not a tactical war game lol.

While on the subject, what if girl rank and free/slave status affected the chances of being attacked?  For example, A beggar would be willing to attack a rank 1 slave, but not anything rank 4 and above.  Also, a noble would be willing to attack a rank 8 slave, but less likely to attack a rank 8 free girl.

Of course, that does get right back to the point you just made.

Anyway, on a different note, here's another concept for addressing the Next Day exploit.

I've read some of the other posts on adding BDSM into the game.  While I do agree on what would need to be done, in order to incorporate BDSM, I'd like to run this idea by you.

The BDSM sex act should have increased fatigue gain, some loss of health or both.  I'm thinking of another game (probably SimBro), where 1 BDSM act would take a girl out of work for a couple of days.  Now, I'm not saying that you should directly copy that, but it is an interesting idea to use.

You could start off with something like 3 BDSM acts are enough to put a girl on auto-rest.  This would cause players to utilize Incense of Serenity and Healing Potions, in order to stay in operation.

However, the player should be able to mitigate this with the use of brothel upgrades, items or both.

An example for the brothel upgrade would be different levels of BDSM equipment.  The use of quality equipment would cause less harm to the girl.

For an item example, I'd say the slave chains.  Since the girl is already restrained, the customer doesn't have to get rough with the girl in order to restrain her.  A good upgrade would be something like Fuzzy Handcuffs, which would still restrain the girl, but won't cut into her wrists (thus, she takes less damage).

All in all, this would prevent players from using the Next Day exploit, until they have their brothel firmly established.  Once they're at that point, then there isn't much of a need for them to use the Next Day exploit.

Well, I just thought I'd run this by you.  Of course, this idea can't be utilized if BDSM isn't implemented.  But, if you ever do implement BDSM, then this might help.

I should really make this into a signature, but feel free to use, abuse or make fun of my suggestions. 

[Xela]

I do agree, but does this mean you are doing away with the Guard job?  All I'm suggesting is to tweak the frequency of existing events.

But, I do see your point.  This is a brothel sim, not a tactical war game lol.

While on the subject, what if girl rank and free/slave status affected the chances of being attacked?  For example, A beggar would be willing to attack a rank 1 slave, but not anything rank 4 and above.  Also, a noble would be willing to attack a rank 8 slave, but less likely to attack a rank 8 free girl.

There is/will be combat, just shouldn't be in a brothel. I am not disregarding the guard job since there is always a chance of unruly customers in borohel/stripclub/bar. I simply don't want to make something crazy out of it. I don't like the idea with the different ranks not attacking one another, seems a bit out there.

Anyway, on a different note, here's another concept for addressing the Next Day exploit.

I've read some of the other posts on adding BDSM into the game.  While I do agree on what would need to be done, in order to incorporate BDSM, I'd like to run this idea by you.

The BDSM sex act should have increased fatigue gain, some loss of health or both.  I'm thinking of another game (probably SimBro), where 1 BDSM act would take a girl out of work for a couple of days.  Now, I'm not saying that you should directly copy that, but it is an interesting idea to use.

You could start off with something like 3 BDSM acts are enough to put a girl on auto-rest.  This would cause players to utilize Incense of Serenity and Healing Potions, in order to stay in operation.

However, the player should be able to mitigate this with the use of brothel upgrades, items or both.

An example for the brothel upgrade would be different levels of BDSM equipment.  The use of quality equipment would cause less harm to the girl.

For an item example, I'd say the slave chains.  Since the girl is already restrained, the customer doesn't have to get rough with the girl in order to restrain her.  A good upgrade would be something like Fuzzy Handcuffs, which would still restrain the girl, but won't cut into her wrists (thus, she takes less damage).

All in all, this would prevent players from using the Next Day exploit, until they have their brothel firmly established.  Once they're at that point, then there isn't much of a need for them to use the Next Day exploit.

Well, I just thought I'd run this by you.  Of course, this idea can't be utilized if BDSM isn't implemented.  But, if you ever do implement BDSM, then this might help.

I should really make this into a signature, but feel free to use, abuse or make fun of my suggestions. 

It's a decent idea... BDSM similar to SimBro 1X where a specialized upgrade was required and it meant a great deal of money at once. This at cost of disposition (unless traits are applied), joy (same) and fatigue...

Yeap, this could be a way to go...