General Discussion

[DarkTl]

Very well. Here are my thoughts.
* Unlike medkits, potions work instantly (irl they would be priceless). However, in camp time is not as limited as in BE, and medkits definitely should be less expensive and rare.
* But you can't patch the same place over and over again, while potions can heal it over and over again. So you cannot use medkits infinitely, eventually you need either return to the city and rest or drink powerful enough potion.
* We always can limit team inventory for explorations. Would be strange to have access to 2000 items in a middle of some deep dungeon. It makes sense in the city, but not everywhere.
* Along with medkits there could be quest items like tents and provisions if we talking about multi-day expedition, to restore mp/fatigue.

[MrKlaus]

It would be harder to explain (I guess something along the lines of areas being too unstable to use potions safely so medkits are required). I see no reason why amount of medkits should be limited while space to carry other items is not. Medkits thing would be a bit of a stretch but definitely simpler to code, would also be an excuse to add that quest items category Dark mentioned.

I need more opinions on this one... not going to code either approach until we've decided.

 Explanation: Potions are a liquid stored inside vials, bottles = it's a pain in the ass to transport something like that in the field, not speaking about using something like that in battle or ensuring its safety. There is a possibility that after a battle, a girl would be “last man standing” and heavy bleeding  not able to be saved, because a potion vial broke during a fight.


On the other hand. Combat Med Kits would be a simple bag containing items for mayor healing like bandages, balms, maybe something else and small vials with CONCENTRATED potions for real life threaten situations. But as an inside game item, the player would only see a icon of a med kit. All the shit that is inside would only be mentioned in the description. And for justifying necessity of buying another med kits, the usage could be 3-4 times.   
 
Or a different approach for healing an exploration team. Make the party 4 people. The 3 of them would do what they currently do, stuff like combat, exploring, bringing goods to the camp.
The 4th would be a non combat, support role that maintain the camp, prepare food and drag away heavy wounded team members (making them survive a wipe) and provides healing after a battle.
 
And my stand for potions as an inside game item. Let them be, but for a higher price and little more rarer.  Something like in the lines of “You want to save yourself, pay us for it”.
 
Last question. When team explore and gets in a fight does they heal between the attacks or is it a last man standing brawl and the team heals after the fight?

[DarkTl]

Besides,
* Medkits require some skill, while potions don't. We don't have healer occupation/trait/stat/skill right now, so we probably will need it.
* Inventory size could be based on constitution and agility, but it should have a maximum.
* We can't really capture rmgs without any kind of dungeon/training, but I guess they already could be randomly encountered and convinced to join the group with high enough charisma.
* You cannot explore the same place over and over every day. Or, rather, you can, but with no results.
* Since we (finally) have death, we need any kind of resurrection system as well. At least for girls.

Or a different approach for healing an exploration team. Make the party 4 people. The 3 of them would do what they currently do, stuff like combat, exploring, bringing goods to the camp.
The 4th would be a non combat, support role that maintain the camp, prepare food and drag away heavy wounded team members (making them survive a wipe) and provides healing after a battle.

Good idea.
Maybe every member of the team should play a bit different role. Like leader, warrior, supporter, explorer.

Explanation: Potions are a liquid stored inside vials, bottles = it's a pain in the ass to transport something like that in the field, not speaking about using something like that in battle or ensuring its safety. There is a possibility that after a battle, a girl would be “last man standing” and heavy bleeding  not able to be saved, because a potion vial broke during a fight.

Eventually we want an offshoot for ES where MC personally explores some (important enough) dungeons with a small team. With this exploration we will never be able to use potions during explorations, even inside BE.

[Xela]

Lets keep shit simple, these are expansion ideas, difficult to code and with little return.

Potions:
- Makes sense
- No need to explain anything

MedKits:
- Need to explain why potions aren't working
- Slightly easier to code

We are not going to add 4th member or limit inventories or anything like that. I do like the tents/provisions idea... we could do that for initial release.

When team explore and gets in a fight does they heal between the attacks or is it a last man standing brawl and the team heals after the fight?

No, they are no attacks either, combat is a very simple calculation comparing relevant stats and luck. They get healed after the fight.

[MrKlaus]

 I won’t say that potions aren’t working, but in some situations you have to take a different approach then the normal way of doing things. Can you imagine a dark cave, full of unknown dangers and our happy group exploring it with the sound of potion bottles hitting each other?
 
But why med kits and not potions.
 
MedKit advantages:

Mobility – easier to transport and take with yourself for exploring, only one package of life saving items, then a crate full of potions or a satchel bag. Potions just weight more.

One potion can do only one thing, when MedKit is more handy and can be used to treat multiple injuries like: burns, poisoning, disinfect wounds, some sort of pain killing, HP/MP restoration. So less space taken by the medkit, then a set of different potions.

MedKit is a team item. It can be used several times by every team member before disappearing, when potions will go down in dozens. For example; if a team will be out for four days and every event will end in fight the potion usage will be sky high. Who takes a cart of HP potions with them into the wild? Just grab your handy med kit or two that will help you survive in the wild. 
 
Btw. This post sounds like a sales person, that would be convincing you to buy the Amazing MedKit for the outrageous low price of… and I will stop right here.
 

[Xela]

LoL

I don't think those are very good points from games perspective... I'll leave the potions/medkits for tomorrow, today I'll see if I can add the guild to the summary report, that is a good bit of work.

[MrKlaus]

 Dark mentioned that the party could have a maximum load.

Then something more simple from the game view.
So let say the teams max inventory will be 100. Let assume that ONE potion will take 1 spot in the inventory. Then sending a team for three days and wanting to be on safe side, preconceiving two fight a day, you would have to give them in total 18 potions. So 18/100 taken. But if the MedKit have an option of being used (heals)3 times, you would only buy 6 for the team.  So less space is taken, more loot can be acquired.
 

[CherryWood]

Guys, I really don't want to decide this thing myself, both options (normal potions and medkits) are really good. Just comment your thought on this thing, I wanna code this in tonight.

If you really want everyone option, then I will be bit of a rebel there with mine, cause I would prefer to have no instant healing in the whole game at all 

[Xela]

If you really want everyone option, then I will be bit of a rebel there with mine, cause I would prefer to have no instant healing in the whole game at all 

Ghm.. that would be an interesting concept but a bit unusual...

[CherryWood]

Ghm.. that would be an interesting concept but a bit unusual...

For classic RPG, where critically injured character pretty much means that you can't play anymore, yes.
But in managers or tactical games (like UFO) it's not uncommon that injured character is out of action for a while. 



So for exploration, where girls have time in a camp each day of progress, medkits that restores small portion of HP sounds good to me (as replacement of rest action they would otherwise do at home), but they really don't make any sense when potions exists.    Maybe if the usage of potions were hardly limited by frequency, like one in few days or so...




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I started adding and adjusting girlmeets lines (with preserving current code)

[MrKlaus]

 If you guys aren’t convinced in existents of MedKits, then let’s just drop the idea and stick with potions. Ultimately it was just a proposition of a new item, it doesn’t mean that it have to be implemented.
 

[DarkTl]

Dark mentioned that the party could have a maximum load.

Don't worry, I will convince him to limit exploration party inventory eventually when we will expand ES more in the future 

BUT if usage of healing potions is limited, like that you can only drink one in a few days, then it would be perfectly fine and reasonable to use both.

Could be easily implemented and would be a good explanation too.

But in this case we won't be able to use potions in BE, including arena. Then again, it's not like we already have an advanced BE heavily based on drinking potions. We always can add healing spells, and explain that you cannot cast them all the time in those abnormal regions.

Let's add medkits, tents and provisions as a new item type. I guess they should have number of uses btw.
I will limit usage of potions then.

I'm also thinking about adding items like gemstones and treasure chests (already have many good icons) that cannot be used and could be only bought and sold. Because it's less strange than finding gold coins all the time in some forest.

[Xela]

Well, gold = loot, we don't have to specify. Lets keep sh!t simple.

My head hurts, been messing with geometry and sprite movements in Ren'Py... it's fun but really cutting into dev time...

[DarkTl]

But those icons are cool and pretty 
Maybe we at least could just use them in exploration gui somewhere.

Well then, let's discuss a new meeting system concept little by little.
1) Since we divide dating and meeting, MC's goal during meetings is to either hire a girl or become her friend and then proceed to hiring or dating.
Initially you could hire only low lvl, poor characters that don't have a job. Maybe you also need at least 50-100 disposition before they agree. In order to hire high lvl ones you need to achieve friend status (let's say, 500 disposition) and then ask them to join you.
So we need levels, and not only random ones for rgirls. We need them in girls data files too.

2) After achieving friend status you should know where a girl lives (I have some backgrounds for girls rooms in my db), so you can find her anytime without having to rely on chance. I guess it should look like a list of girls called notebook or something.
In the future friend status should mean that you have some limited access to girl's inventory as well.

2) Initial impression. Depending on MC's stats, initial disposition could be higher than 0. For example, id= (charisma+refinement)/4 or something like that.

Moreover, various girls traits may lower id. For example, shy/dandere could have lower id not because they dislike MC, but because it's harder to gain their trust in general. I believe it could be easily achieved by adding mod disposition in traits files.

Any thoughts so far?

[MrKlaus]

But those icons are cool and pretty 
Maybe we at least could just use them in exploration gui somewhere.

Dark, try something like this:


 About other more creative suggestions.
Maybe also add something like a stat window in a classic date-sim game. Where the player could check the affection towards the MC by the girls that the MC already met? Also a “go visit” button could be in there, allowing visiting the girls home.
 
And question:
Are you guys thinking of forcing a free, met girl to do what you want? I’m asking about raping and kidnapping her into slavery (something like: “The punch to the stomach cut her lights out. You dragged her to your place”).