General Discussion

[MrKlaus]

That would enable spamming, I'll think about what can be done here, maybe 1/3 of an AP or something...

 Maybe something like a “meet  action count”. Depending on the NPC mood, friendship lvl, general interest in MC the scale of possible interactions would vary from 4 to 10 (not too much)? And the whole meeting would "eat" only 1AP.

 

[Xela]

Hi!
A time based system would solve this problem in a very elegant way, but that would mean some oh so despised code base changes. 

But seriously, introducing 1/3rd APs or a subsystem that maps one action point to three gm action points isn't much less effort, it's just a lot more dirty with guaranteed inflexibility.
Have fun!

It's doable (with enough time invested, I cannot foresee any huge problems) but we agreed on AP approach which I personally prefer. This would make a lot of thing easier and harder at the same time Main argument against are backgrounds... which any player would expect to reflect time of day.

Maybe something like a “meet  action count”. Depending on the NPC mood, friendship lvl, general interest in MC the scale of possible interactions would vary from 4 to 10 (not too much)? And the whole meeting would "eat" only 1AP.

Need to take a look at the code when time permits. It's fairly difficult to tell what's best and what's possible, maybe we don't actually fraction the APs, some actions will take 1, some 0.5 and some 0.33. We wouldn't subtract APs directly, 1/3 would mean 2 actions for free and -1 AP on third or something like that.

[livingforever]

Hi!
Oh great, one of those cases in which I just can't see the problems you are talking about.

It's doable (with enough time invested, I cannot foresee any huge problems)

Actually, it doesn't need much time investment. In fact, I have a pseudo-coded class to handle things with time instead of AP ready to go, I'll send you a PM.

This would make a lot of thing easier and harder at the same time

The only thing that is getting more difficult is balance - but at the same time it is getting a lot better because of the flexibility.

Main argument against are backgrounds... which any player would expect to reflect time of day.

And who said that the player is working during the night?
8 to 18 o'clock are very usual working times, can't see a problem here.

Need to take a look at the code when time permits. It's fairly difficult to tell what's best and what's possible, maybe we don't actually fraction the APs, some actions will take 1, some 0.5 and some 0.33. We wouldn't subtract APs directly, 1/3 would mean 2 actions for free and -1 AP on third or something like that.

This actually brings up more problems than a time based approach (and in the long term it will be more work because it's more difficult to maintain).
Also, it is a lot less intuitive because your actions don't reflect AP changes immediately.
Have fun!

[Xela]

Nah, if we decide to do this it will be after the next release and it should be a proper 24 hour day for night time jobs as well. It's not a bad idea, we'll decide post second alpha release, adapting the code then won't be any more difficult then it is  now.

[DarkTl]

I don't know. Many games have time system, SM3 first comes to mind. But in fact time system disguises ap system there, APs=hours, and you can use a part of AP in case of small events.

[livingforever]

Nah, if we decide to do this it will be after the next release and it should be a proper 24 hour day for night time jobs as well.

And which player jobs can only be done at night? Also, which human being works for 24 hours a day? Don't get me wrong, I won't object a "proper" system, but a 24 hour time window for the player to act is simply unrealistic and therefore doesn't need to be possible.

It's not a bad idea, we'll decide post second alpha release, adapting the code then won't be any more difficult then it is  now.

Statements like these drive me crazy. You want to decide on a core feature after a release? And you're wrong, it will be more difficult. The longer you wait, the more deprecated stuff you will have to replace.
On the other hand, I do not know how close you are to the next alpha, so - whatever.

I don't know. Many games have time system, SM3 first comes to mind. But in fact time system disguises ap system there, APs=hours, and you can use a part of AP in case of small events.

Basically, yes. But time is a more intuitive value than action points and I have never seen an action point system with 1440 AP per day (because in almost all of these systems action points equal minutes, not hours).
Have fun!

[Xela]

SM system would be less flexible then what we have now. I'll see what can be done with girlsmeets and interactions when time permits?

[Thewlis]

You could just multiply all the current AP by 3.

Player starts with 9, a normal action now costs 3. An action during a girl meet now only costs 1.

[Xela]

You could just multiply all the current AP by 3.

Player starts with 9, a normal action now costs 3. An action during a girl meet now only costs 1.

Too many jobs would have to be adjusted as well, a lot of things consume AP and only girlsmeets feel like an issue atm.

[livingforever]

Hi again!

SM system would be less flexible then what we have now. I'll see what can be done with girlsmeets and interactions when time permits?

I have no idea what the SM system looks like, but I don't know how what I propose can be less flexible than a flat AP system. Would you care to explain?
Don't worry about time, I'm not saying "do this right now or I'll kill you".

You could just multiply all the current AP by 3.

Player starts with 9, a normal action now costs 3. An action during a girl meet now only costs 1.

Too many jobs would have to be adjusted as well, a lot of things consume AP and only girlsmeets feel like an issue atm.

That would actually be a very simple solution that isn't horribly unintuitive. Just add a compatibility method (old method calls new method with AP parameter * 3).

It should be mentioned that I don't really like this, but at least it's more clean than what you planned to do with split APs.
Have fun!

[Gismo]

Prepared a test version of the mc-setup (start game) screen.

[Xela]

I have no idea what the SM system looks like, but I don't know how what I propose can be less flexible than a flat AP system. Would you care to explain?

That was a messed up reply due to a use of Android Phone. SM bit was a response to Dark who mentioned SM3. Bit I wrote quoting your post disappeared.

Just add a compatibility method (old method calls new method with AP parameter * 3).

You could just multiply all the current AP by 3.

Player starts with 9, a normal action now costs 3. An action during a girl meet now only costs 1.

This is prolly worth consideration. If we can get AP for everyone to work this way without too much fuss, it's definitely an option.

[Xela]

Prepared a test version of the mc-setup (start game) screen.

Looks great as usual

[DarkTl]

I dislike fractional APs idea, it seems counterintuitive and clumsy.

Time system could work, though it will give us new problems with balancing. MC and girls are supposed to have more AP at higher levels, meaning that they become more hardy. If we drop this concept and use pure time system, when you need 15 min to speak with a girl and 2 hours to fight at arena, then constitution doesn't matter anymore. You can't really speak or fight quicker at higher levels, well, generally speaking.
And of course many areas don't have night pictures, but we can avoid it by forcing MC to sleep at night or visit only those areas that have night backgrounds.

I'd prefer Klaus solution or less valuable and more numerous APs.

Prepared a test version of the mc-setup (start game) screen.

I like everything but those two grey buttons.

[Xela]

And of course many areas don't have night pictures, but we can avoid it by forcing MC to sleep at night or visit only those areas that have night backgrounds.

Nah, restructuring code to proper timebase without stuff like vampirism (sleeps during daytime + sh!tz) or simply allow MC to sleep whenever he likes (getting low on fatigue or something) is absurd. This will suck if done halfway and doing it properly will take time and effort. We'll get back to this post next release + I don't want to double SimBrothel Revival, they have proper time based approach, I can't say I like it a lot more then what we have but it prolly makes more sense for an RPG based game. It's also not how they either started btw.

I'd prefer Klaus solution or less valuable and more numerous APs.

Ok... so the way I see Klauses approach considering the code is setting an amount responses on per day bases for every girl (first encounter eats up 1AP regardless). After that amount is reached girls simply respond with something like: Lets talk again tomorrow/We're done for the day and etc.

more numerous APs.

We turn AP into a property (if that isn't done already) for all character and make sure 1 AP is subtracted during girlsmeets/interaction per action and 3 AP per action everywhere else (unless specified otherwise). We multiply all AP * 3 during the next day restoration method.

Two options to choose atm.