Game Design/Ideas

[DarkTl]

I vaguely imagine our goal, so I just throwing ideas 

What will happen if your fatigue will reach max during the exploration while you don't have any items to restore it?

[Xela]

What will happen if your fatigue will reach max during the exploration while you don't have any items to restore it?

Game over?

I vaguely imagine our goal, so I just throwing ideas 

Same here, but I figure our goal is to create a simple exploration engine so we'll have a map in the right corner of the screen, made out of a number of tiles. Each tile will have it's properties like fog of war, blocked, chance of battle encounter, background to be displayed on the screen, color of the tile on the map, possibility of NPC encounter and many more I expect.

Basically imagine 10x10 to 100x100 tile (more than that is prolly annoying) grid player can walk through and each tile can has it's own properties, that's what I am working towards anyway...

[DarkTl]

Game over?

Hm, in ME when you running out of fuel away from civilization, you have to pay for rescue operation. I believe it should be game over if you don't have money, but what if you do have them?

Maybe 30 or 50% of current gold. Or a fixed value, like 10000. Or value depending on summary levels of characters in your party, like 200 gold per level or 1-2 gold per 1 point of current experience.

Or we could create expensive items that can teleport you to the city anytime, and if player does not want to risk, he have to buy them.

[Xela]

Hm, in ME when you running out of fuel away from civilization, you have to pay for rescue operation. I believe it should be game over if you don't have money, but what if you do have them?

Awesome idea

Maybe 30 or 50% of current gold. Or a fixed value, like 10000. Or value depending on summary levels of characters in your party, like 200 gold per level or 1-2 gold per 1 point of current experience.

We'll see, no need to decide right now.

Or we could create expensive items that can teleport you to the city anytime, and if player does not want to risk, he have to buy them.

Once again, we can decide later.


Otherwise:

Moving (with out of bound checks)/clearing out fog of war is working

[DarkTl]

Another idea is using cells like in Eador. There you can explore each single cell several times, until its level of exploration will become 100%.
Each time you could find items, events and/or mobs, and level of exploration randomly increases depending on MC stats.

After 100% you cannot explore it anymore, but we could reset it in the begining of each exploration.

[Xela]

Another idea is using cells like in Eador. There you can explore each single cell several times, until its level of exploration will become 100%.
Each time you could find items, events and/or mobs, and level of exploration randomly increases depending on MC stats.

After 100% you cannot explore it anymore, but we could reset it in the begining of each exploration.

I am not sure I follow, that's kinda like my original plan with background and encounters until cleared?

What do you think a good mapsize should be?

[DarkTl]

I am not sure I follow, that's kinda like my original plan with background and encounters until cleared?

Not exactly. Let's say we have a map with two types of cells, forest and swamp type. In swamp and forest there are different types of mobs, items and events.

If player wants to fight with forest mobs only, hunting for forest items only, etc., he could ignore swamp cell comletely (except for those moments when he is forced to cross them) and explore the forest cell several times, until exploration level will became 100%. It doesn't mean that he have to explore it to 100% to move futher, like in your original plan.

After 100% if player still doesn't want to explore swamp (because swamp mobs are too strong or weak, for example), he could either find another forest cell on our map (and that's not easy because of fog of war, especially when we'll have random maps) or ruturn to the city, and, let's say, after several days map will reset.

This way player doesn't just randomly (aimlessly?) explore maps, but looks for good cells.

What do you think a good mapsize should be?

I think 4x4 or even less for a starting location (when everyone in your party have 1 level, you don't have a lot of fatigue), and 8x8 or 10x10 for more advanced locations.

[Xela]

Not exactly. Let's say we have a map with two types of cells, forest and swamp type. In swamp and forest there are different types of mobs, items and events.

If player wants to fight with forest mobs only, hunting for forest items only, etc., he could ignore swamp cell comletely (except for those moments when he is forced to cross them) and explore the forest cell several times, until exploration level will became 100%. It doesn't mean that he have to explore it to 100% to move futher, like in your original plan.

After 100% if player still doesn't want to explore swamp (because swamp mobs are too strong or weak, for example), he could either find another forest cell on our map (and that's not easy because of fog of war, especially when we'll have random maps) or ruturn to the city, and, let's say, after several days map will reset.

With other words: Each tile should have a number of possible encounters set up, player fights (on dice throw) when stepping on a tile and can fight a couple more times if he so desires?

After some time has passed, number of encounters restores itself and player can fight again?

This way player doesn't just randomly (aimlessly?) explore maps, but looks for good cells.
I think 4x4 or even less for a starting location (when everyone in your party have 1 level, you don't have a lot of fatigue), and 8x8 or 10x10 for more advanced locations.

LoL

I was thinking we start with something like 40x40

In any case, what kind of tiles/mods should we make???

PS: I've tried doing this for Alkion seven month ago and gave up after 1.5 weeks. Now this is what we have after less than a days work (map is 20x10, blue = impassible):

[DarkTl]

With other words: Each tile should have a number of possible encounters set up, player fights (on dice throw) when stepping on a tile and can fight a couple more times if he so desires?

After some time has passed, number of encounters restores itself and player can fight again?

Yup. We could make a button there, "explore" or something, so player doesn't need to move somewhere, he could just stand and fight until 100% exploration level.
In Eador there is exploration skill responsible for exploration, but I don't think we need it. We could just randomise the number of available encounters, for example from 3 to 15 per cell.
And for now we have game over when fatigue is max.

Not to mention the way back (I guess maps will have entrances and exits?).

I was thinking we start with something like 40x40

To explore 1600 cells with 5 fatigue per move you need 8000 fatigue. Even with free access to inventory this is nearly impossible without cheating or resting in the forest itself.
To explore 4x4=16 cells you need 80 fatigue. Not every character will have even 80 fatigue at 1 level.

In any case, what kind of tiles/mods should we make???

Well, we have only forest now. So I guess forest, elven forest, dark/evil/whatever forest, marshy woodlands, etc. Also I have a lot of pics for forest ruins, so either you could find ruins with items during exploration, or we could make actual forest ruins cells, which will be randomly placed on maps in the future, and maybe they will be hidden too. We also could use impenetrable thicket to make walls if we'll need them.
Not sure about mods, let's decide with titles first.

PS: I've tried doing this for Alkion seven month ago and gave up after 1.5 weeks. Now this is what we have after less than a days work (map is 20x10, blue = impassible):

Wow, looks great 

[Xela]

Yup. We could make a button there, "explore" or something, so player doesn't need to move somewhere, he could just stand and fight until 100% exploration level.
In Eador there is exploration skill responsible for exploration, but I don't think we need it. We could just randomise the number of available encounters, for example from 3 to 15 per cell.
And for now we have game over when fatigue is max.

Not to mention the way back (I guess maps will have entrances and exits?).

Ok, this is pure logic, I'll think of the best way to code this.

To explore 1600 cells with 5 fatigue per move you need 8000 fatigue. Even with free access to inventory this is nearly impossible without cheating or resting in the forest itself.

Actually, starting with around 40x40, we can actually build "rooms" and connect them with corridors (using code). We'll see what'll work best...

To explore 4x4=16 cells you need 80 fatigue. Not every character will have even 80 fatigue at 1 level.
Well, we have only forest now. So I guess forest, elven forest, dark/evil/whatever forest, marshy woodlands, etc. Also I have a lot of pics for forest ruins, so either you could find ruins with items during exploration, or we could make actual forest ruins cells, which will be randomly placed on maps in the future, and maybe they will be hidden too. We also could use impenetrable thicket to make walls if we'll need them.
Not sure about mods, let's decide with titles first.

Fatigue is maxed at 300 for all characters and we're not changing that. We got to decide on which enemies go where...

Wow, looks great 

Team stats added:




I am going to see if I can code battle encounters with some base enemy now and put some buttons on the screen.

[Xela]

Ok, I am going to take a small break, get my head straight.

I figure we need the following type of tiles and logic for them:

1) Base impassible tile

2) Base combat tile:
- Background
- Background for battle encounters
- Needs enemy sprites
- Max amount of encounters until cleared
- Chance of combat starting when first explored
- Enemy Stats
- Items (battle reward logic)
- Fatigue cost to pass

3) Save Game/Warp to city tile
- Background

4) Event tile (Quest/NPC/Traders/treasure etc.)
- Background
- Label jump to start the scriptable encounter/event if so desired

What else?

After I get the logic down in the main class, it might be possible to build maps and tiles in JSON format (meaning that we can have forests/dungeons/caves and so on built in the similar way to characters/items)

[DarkTl]

I guess we need mechanics for rm girls, not just usual enemies. Even if we won't allow to capture them yet, they already could be used as enemies.

Also special terrain could affect party in different ways outside (for example, title that heal the whole party somewhere before boss, or poison traps inside dungeon) and inside BE.

We might need titles for bosses with different appearance, when you enter there, you will fight with 100% probability with specific enemy. Maybe with flag to appearing again or not after some time.

Besides, we have items that affect all/free/slave girls in brothel. I wonder if and how they should work during exploration.
Oh, and looks like they don't work at MC at all.

[Xela]

I guess we need mechanics for rm girls, not just usual enemies. Even if we won't allow to capture them yet, they already could be used as enemies.

Maybe on special hardcoded tiles, normal enemies should be enough for now?

Also special terrain could affect party in different ways outside (for example, title that heal the whole party somewhere before boss, or poison traps inside dungeon) and inside BE.

Healing tile than, effect can be used once in 10 days... otherwise I think poison tile is an overkill and not in sync with current game mechanics (that apply poison effect on day turn).

We might need titles for bosses with different appearance, when you enter there, you will fight with 100% probability with specific enemy. Maybe with flag to appearing again or not after some time.

? Custom enemy tile with a single encounter max and 100% chance? But I'll take care of advanced stuff with script.

Besides, we have items that affect all/free/slave girls in brothel. I wonder if and how they should work during exploration.
Oh, and looks like they don't work at MC at all.

1) Player will not be able to put those items on the belt.

2) They were never designed to work on MC (even effect is called "allgirls", our MC is male.)

[DarkTl]

Maybe on special hardcoded tiles, normal enemies should be enough for now?

I guess. I'm still not sure which mechanics we should use for them. Maybe we could use traps, like in that Old Huntman's game

Healing tile than, effect can be used once in 10 days... otherwise I think poison tile is an overkill and not in sync with current game mechanics (that apply poison effect on day turn).

Ok, then arrow trap (-10 hp or something). Dungeons do need some kind of traps anyway.

? Custom enemy tile with a single encounter max and 100% chance? But I'll take care of advanced stuff with script.

Well, since you going to use json to create locations, I'm not sure how are you going to use scripts at the same time.

They were never designed to work on MC (even effect is called "allgirls", our MC is male.)

If you say so. If someone ever will ask me why healing mist works on everyone but MC, I'll give link to your post 

[Xela]

I guess. I'm still not sure which mechanics we should use for them. Maybe we could use traps, like in that Old Huntman's game

Enemy girl's agility vs member with highest agility on player team taking luck and some random factors into account? But it's for the future.

Ok, then arrow trap (-10 hp or something). Dungeons do need some kind of traps anyway.

Oki, "Trap Tiles" than as well.

Well, since you going to use json to create locations, I'm not sure how are you going to use scripts at the same time.

Do you think that I cannot create girl/item/marker on the map/trail/brothel with pure script right now? Complex and unique stuff we'll do with script, simple maps and encounters with JSON.

If you say so. If someone ever will ask me why healing mist works on everyone but MC, I'll give link to your post 

Deal