Town Wards

[d31r3x]

Mmmm, pea soup... Yummy 


Yeah, I felt it screwed the colour balance. That was a test, the intention was composing city name, motto banner and coat of arms: size, placing, shape... I had no good ideas about the CoA, so I drawed the first thing that came to my mind. You know, "if you don't know where to begin, just begin anywhere". Looks like I got the thing started so you guys can complain, then I'll do something else -better- and that way we can move on...

Regarding the colour palette, it's a just basic model -there's a lot of post processing work to be done, including hue shifts, paper textures and effect stuff. I'm still testing a range of variations to see what seems to fit better, so feedback is welcomed.


On the other hand, criticism is cheap if not paired with wise suggestions...

[Shinteo]

Forget about him. I happen to think you did a good job. My only suggestion is to maybe make every district a different colour, so as to more easily tell them apart. Oh, and maybe explain the coat of arms. I don't really get it.

[fixet]

I'm not bashing you, just saying what I think

and I did give a suggestion, wise or not
I'd like the map to look like a sketch of a map, complete with random scribbled notes and ruler marks, possibly getting completed as you acquire wards (with overlays of the real map)
but whenever I have a suggestion, I get screamed at for forcing my way on everything and everyone

as for more technical suggestions, if you want to keep the coat of arms where it is, you'd might want something in the sea part of the map to balance it out
lie those waves or dragons or boats you see in "old maps"

I don't like the coat of arms at all

[d31r3x]

Calm down, Fixet. Last line of my post was "hey, there's no point in being that harsh", not "if you don't like it, go to hell".

I use to take every opinion into consideration. Obviously, there are some points that don't affect my work at all, usually related to game dynamics and such (go with those to dev team, I'm just the guy who draws the map). And I will tell the same tale again: the damm thing is not finished yet (usually, a dev's catchphrase  , badumching!). There's still much to be done, I'm testing stuff as I slowly structure the drawing, test colours and textures,  sketch the wards and add "map furnishings".

On the "map furnishings" issue, there's a bunch of them: city banner, motto and coat of arms are used almost always on city plans. Besides, there's the compass, the sea serpent, the "here be dragons", the wind blowing cloud / greek god and such. I'm beginning with the basics... but I'm open to good ideas.

You said you like it "sketch style". Know what? me too:





The coat of arms, city banner and motto is something I would like to include. This does not mean that they have to be the first ones I drawed. So, if you people have any good ideas on this subject, now it's the right time: Coat of Arms and City motto (the name stays the same, I guess...)

The coat of arms at this moment is not the best, I ran out of ideas. On the other hand, I think the city motto is a good one: "Quod magia non dat, vis non praestat" -Which (whatever) magic doesn't give (achieve), violence (might, strenght) doesn't lend (gives instead of, substitutes).

And, Shinteo, different colour is possible but I was trying to make them "look" different using various block shapes and street structure for each ward so it worked even in monochrome.

[fixet]

I am calm
I didn't mean to come off as hostile, and I like the city layout
the new pics you posted look awesome

[Amoeba]

If it were just a map, I'd be with fixet on preferring a sketch map, as I find that more appealing, but I think for a game map, a more solid appearance would be more fitting. Buttons atop the sketch would look very... odd, afterall. For what colors I'd suggest using for that... I'm honestly not too sure. I do think perfectly flat colors aren't the way to go though. A subtle texture effect over the individual blocks maybe? That way you could use less colors, but with the varying size and shapes, it would help to create more of a contrast.

As for the Coat of Arms, I think it looks off because the primary symbol feels closed off and trapped. If you removed the white triangle, kept the contrasting colors on the left and right, and scaled up the symbol, I think it'd look a lot better. You'd probably want to color the gate and sun though.

[d31r3x]

Game interface integration  Good point. Thanks, mate.

Had to add that to my list. Anyway, only Doc knows about the new map interface, and a funny thing happened to him in the way to the forum... So, I think I'll work over the existing one.

I've made some quick tests, and I have to say it is definitively possible to use sketch style maps on the interface. I've found it harder to use solid color ones, as black fractal background and cyan interface / buttons are little friendly with the Oblivion style brownish monochrome map I had in mind.



Other approach could be the integration of the game interface on the map (and not the opposite). I've made a test changing the hue of the town wards map to match the cyan interface so the buttons look "embeded" in the map. Looks ugly, but I retain the idea just in case the sketched style map does not make it.



The coat of arms is a tricky matter. It's not only the "graphism" issue (wich can be fixed doing the sort of things that you proposed). Purists will probably want a more symbolic / heraldic approach. And, combining the two, a great (and futile) controversy can arise. If I hadn't had enough controversy with the religions issue (wich is, in fact, one of the most controversial subjects in human history), maybe I would start another one...

[Abtakha]

I can't think of any cities that have a coat of arms of their own seems to be more a guild/family thing, which seems to be a bit closer concept than a lot of people would think...
but looking through some old coats.... I don't see anything to complain about this one

[Amoeba]

Ha, I hadn't though of the background and bottom buttons clashing. I was only thinking about the brothel, marketplace, slaver, ect ect buttons. Now I feel silly for missing that.

As for the coat of arms, to be honest, I've never understood people getting up in arms over their symbolism. The way Coats of Arms vary make it difficult to find a benchmark, and more often then not, the symbolism is so basic it could apply to anything, like London's. Either that or it beats you over the head with it, like the Vatican's.

[Mehzerz]

Coat of arms and type that says "City of Crossgate" is pretty big in my opinion... Code of Arms is anyways. Besides, shouldn't they be smudged a little if it's supposed to be like an old map? It stands out too much for my taste, but it could be me. (Graphic designer here) as for the map, I think it looks great!

[megamanx]

Coat of arms and type that says "City of Crossgate" is pretty big in my opinion... Code of Arms is anyways. Besides, shouldn't they be smudged a little if it's supposed to be like an old map? It stands out too much for my taste, but it could be me. (Graphic designer here) as for the map, I think it looks great!

I agree there because for the time frame that i think we have for this is middle ages and at that time they were using quills to write so some ink blotches and smudges would add to the character of the game not detract from it

[Dagoth]

Since we were already considering having locked areas grayed out, perhaps we could just have the base map in that sketch style and each unlocked available area of the city show up in color and/or with more detail.

[d31r3x]

Of course, the coat of arms, city name and motto were meant to add a 'medieval' flavour.

The coat of arms stuff is not blurred and stands out because I forgot post-processing and just pasted it on the top layer, hehehe. And, yeah, maybe they could be smaller (or at least have less "weight")...  you end looking at them instead of the city plan. 

If we're going on with the sketch style map, some scratches, smudges and ink efffects could be added. Never done that before, since my personal preference tends to be pencil / graphite / charcoal instead of ink. So, to all graphic artists: I could use some help with filters and/or post processing procedure to make those effects.

Regarding the coat of arms type and city motto, if you have any ideas or found some interesting stuff over the internet, please feel free to contribute.

On the locked / unlocked ward issue, I think the way could be giving full detail to the unlocked wards and leave others blurred and half-sketched. I already had some ideas on that subject, so I'll do some testing and post results.

[Lorde]

If we're going on with the sketch style map, some scratches, smudges and ink efffects could be added. Never done that before, since my personal preference tends to be pencil / graphite / charcoal instead of ink. So, to all graphic artists: I could use some help with filters and/or post processing procedure to make those effects.

You Likey?


 
     

[d31r3x]

Yes, that's the stuff. I didn't thought about the multiple fold effect, looks more real... more 'map'. Maybe it would look even better with more folding marks, and those a little less 'heavy' so the city plan doesn't lose information on the folding zone.

The blur looks like real hand blurring... you know, sometimes when you're quick-sketching with pencil or charcoal you can blur the paper while moving the hand.

Paper texture is a little crispy and that coupled with the brownish tone would match the Oblivion leather map style better than   the sketch type. And it could have issues with the interface and buttons colour / style as well. Anyway, looking at the quick sample looks like it could work:



So, I'm going deeper into the folding marks and blur thing and see how it looks in the pencil sketch style. That also could help in the unlocked / locked wards issue: an accidental hand blurring, partial sketch, white zones with handwriting and such.


Damm it, there's too many things I would like to try, and have little time.