Pink Petal Games
Feedback => New Features => Topic started by: DocClox on December 05, 2009, 06:37:55 AM
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Just kicking some ideas around:
How about making the PC get a slaver's licence before he can apply slave tattoos? it would still be technically illegal to grab women off the street (and probably to enslave girls in his employ for that matter) but as long as he has a licence, no one is going to look too closely at his activities.
The licence would be purchased from the Mayor's office, cost 5000 gold and be renewable annually.
Slaver licences would not be issued to anyone with too bad a rep, so you'd have to work on cleaning up your act once a year if you wanted to keep your licence. One week in 52 you'd need to appear to be a solid citizen.
The player would not start with a licence. You could still buy slaves from the market, you just couldn't make new ones. It might be possible to get the slave market to brand your girls as well, but they'd charge a fee, and if a girl didn't submit, they'd have to let her go, and you'd lose her.
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I like the idea, though it should probably cost more (maybe not when money finally gets balanced, but until then...). There also needs to be some tangible benefit that slaves provide over free girls. Currently, it is the other way around, so it doesn't make much sense to implement just yet, aside from testing it out.
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Wow you think it should cost MORE? I thought 5 grand was kind of excessive... But it's certainly a benefit being able to set slave tattoos. So I can see how it'd make sense to be that expensive.
I like the option to have other slavers do it as well. Very nice alternative.
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Perhaps if free girls could actually quit (PC treated them poorly, they earned enough money, or they simply spent enough time as a whore) there would be incentive for branding them as slaves.
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If we do that then I think there should be a somewhat easier way to raise your reputation. One of the earlier versions of the game your reputation raised when you let people that couldn't pay go, but no longer. The only current way to raise your reputation seems to be by freeing your slaves. I've run a few games where I made it a point to let everyone go and not do anything to anyone, but my reputation always gets dragged down anyway by people that sell me their daughters automatically without asking me. (Perhaps I'm wrong, but I think your reputation gets lowered by anyone going to the dungeon whether its automatic or not.) If it's going to take months to raise your reputation enough to get the slaver's license, and said license is to be renewed annually, there hardly seems a real reason to get it.
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Prices for the licence will (I expect) go into the config.xml file, so you'll be able to set it high or low to suit. In fact, I'll probably set it up so that if the cost is zero, you get it automatically.
Raising rep should be easier when nec's community centers and other special buildings get going. I could also make the price dependent reputation. If you have a bad rep then, to a certain extent, you can still get the licence by paying an outrageous bribe on top of the licence price.
Thinking of the config file, I can probably make rep configurable as well. This config file is rapidly becoming all-consumng...
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have noticed that if you keep customers in dungeons for a suitable time and then release them, your rep goes way up, a bug or intentionally?
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Sounds like a bug - haven't noticed it myself though. I'll have a look at the rep code in a bit :)
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If you make it to where it costs money to make girls slaves, I would vote that slave girls no longer earn half as much as free girls. Simply put, as it is, you would have to enslave several girls to make a net profit if you had to pay to be able to enslave them and, even then, the ammount of money you would get from free girls would be vastly superior.
Also, if you have to purchase a permit, all catacombs girls should come pre-enslaved because it's not as if they were citizens or anyone knew about them before they showed up in your brothel.
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That's why I want there to be a tangible benefit to having slaves over free girls before there are any costs associated with enslaving girls. As it is, buying slaves on the market is vastly inefficient compared to walking the streets and kidnapping. I think the girls should have equal incomes, all other things being equal - why would a customer care whether the girl he's banging is free or a slave? - there is already a built in difference in the house percentages, so there's no need to make the rates charged customers different. Slaves should be less demanding (they'll have no legal recourse if they are treated poorly, so they are more likely to accept whatever working and living conditions the player imposes) and refuse to work less often than free girls with the same rebelliousness (perhaps never refuse to work if the "enchantment" on the "enchanted" slave tattoo has some mind-controlling aspects).
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Makes sense Zodiac.
I'm thinking since there's going to be "jobs" only non-slaves can do. It makes sense that there should be jobs only slaves can do. Thus giving you yet another reason to make some of your girls slaves and some not.
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If you make it to where it costs money to make girls slaves, I would vote that slave girls no longer earn half as much as free girls. Simply put, as it is, you would have to enslave several girls to make a net profit if you had to pay to be able to enslave them and, even then, the ammount of money you would get from free girls would be vastly superior.
Well, first off, you're going to be able to turn this off. Second, you won't have to pay to enslave girls as long as your licence is up to date. I do agree that there's no reason why a well trained and well disciplined slave shouldn't make as much or more as a free whore. That's something else I want to look at.
Personally, I like to run my brothels as slave kennels, so don't worry: I'm not about to break slavery.
Also, if you have to purchase a permit, all catacombs girls should come pre-enslaved because it's not as if they were citizens or anyone knew about them before they showed up in your brothel.
Mmmmm ... not convinced about that one. You want the benefits of slavery, you need the licence.
That's why I want there to be a tangible benefit to having slaves over free girls before there are any costs associated with enslaving girls.
Agreed. Slave girls have been a bit nerfed of late. Really they should both have their benefits and drawbacks.
I think the girls should have equal incomes, all other things being equal - why would a customer care whether the girl he's banging is free or a slave?
Well, I can see that a free girl might show more enthusiasm for the job than a poorly trained slave. But a well trained one should be as good as the best of free women. And really most of that can be handled with rebelliousness scores. So yeah, I tend to agree.
Slaves should be less demanding (they'll have no legal recourse if they are treated poorly, so they are more likely to accept whatever working and living conditions the player imposes) and refuse to work less often than free girls with the same rebelliousness (perhaps never refuse to work if the "enchantment" on the "enchanted" slave tattoo has some mind-controlling aspects).
Yeah, I think slaves should be more obedient too. Like I say, I'm a slavemaster by inclination.
I'm thinking since there's going to be "jobs" only non-slaves can do. It makes sense that there should be jobs only slaves can do. Thus giving you yet another reason to make some of your girls slaves and some not.
Hmmm... I had a couple of ideas along those lines, but they were a bit dark. I can imagine though that you'd get quite a lot of free girls refusing tentacle monster duty though.
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Well, first off, you're going to be able to turn this off. Second, you won't have to pay to enslave girls as long as your licence is up to date. I do agree that there's no reason why a well trained and well disciplined slave shouldn't make as much or more as a free whore. That's something else I want to look at.1
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Mmmmm ... not convinced about that one. You want the benefits of slavery, you need the licence.2
- You're still having to pay 5000 per year as the default which equates to paying 5000/(# of girls your enslaved that year) per slave to enslave them. In other words, if you enslave 10 girls in one year, it costs 500 per girl to enslave them and if you enslave only two it costs 2500 per girl to enslave them.
- It's called enslaving them illegally. Since your brothel has the only entrance to the catacombs, no one will be able to tell if you are catching and enslaving the girls or simply purchasing exotic slaves from some unknown location. Essentially, there is no way for the authorities to tell know if you are enslaving the monster girls when you don't have a permit.
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I was under the impression the majority of the government was corrupt as all fuck. They aren't gonna give a damn if you have a license or not so long as you *cough* pay the proper taxes.... *has sudden idea*
Instead of paying for a license, why not have all slavegirls have a tax, and once a month a guy comes around, checks your girls, and charges you a tax for each one with a tattoo. 5000 is a big price to pay for a guy who only makes like 2 slaves, and a pittance for a guy who makes tons, a tax would scale up with the amount of slaves you have. just make it like 100-300 gold a month.
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Liking the tax idea if we can give slaves some sort of advantage over no slaves.
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I was under the impression the majority of the government was corrupt as all fuck. They aren't gonna give a damn if you have a license or not so long as you *cough* pay the proper taxes.... *has sudden idea*
Instead of paying for a license, why not have all slavegirls have a tax, and once a month a guy comes around, checks your girls, and charges you a tax for each one with a tattoo. 5000 is a big price to pay for a guy who only makes like 2 slaves, and a pittance for a guy who makes tons, a tax would scale up with the amount of slaves you have. just make it like 100-300 gold a turn
You do realize that, until you train the fuck out of slave girls they only make 100-300 gold per turn? Maybe try making your tax 1-3gold per turn
Edit:... I suppose it might be more accurate to say training the fuck into girls instead of out of them, though.
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It's called enslaving them illegally. Since your brothel has the only entrance to the catacombs, no one will be able to tell if you are catching and enslaving the girls or simply purchasing exotic slaves from some unknown location. Essentially, there is no way for the authorities to tell know if you are enslaving the monster girls when you don't have a permit.
There might be a question to ask as to whether monster girls have "rights" to begin with. If you pull out a demon chick from the catacombs, I doubt there would be riots in the streets demanding equal rights and civil liberties for hellspawn. :D
In fact you're probably more likely to see mobs with pitchforks and torches, heh.
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At the end of the day, it's first and foremost a game mechanic. I firmly believe that one of the reasons that winning this game falls somewhat flat is that there's a shortage of intermediate aims and objectives. Making control of the slave tattoo something the player has to work for gives a regular objective. It's a bit of power in the game that has to be earned, rather than given by default. I think this will help build a richer game.
I appreciate that this is not going to be to everyone's taste, and people who'd rather not engage with the more strategic elements of the game can turn it off and it will stay turned off.
And I agree that the economics of slave ownership need rebalancing.
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The main thing I'm going to say is this: If you have to spend money to gain slaves, then slaves should be better than free women who don't cost money.
Say, slaves earn just as much, but cannot refuse to work, and don't complain at not keeping any of their pay.
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Duly noted.
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I think it's a great idea Doc, and if it's an interchangeable setting in the game then no one has a reason to complain.
One of the biggest problems with the game is lack of goals, and I see how you're trying to fix that, and this is certainly a good way of doing it.
It wouldn't hurt to add the ability to get a license that never expires at some point in the game. You complete a certain objective and a new shop opens up in town, with the hidden slave market (Maybe sells only unique girls?) Perhaps double their price) a shop to buy the license that never expires (Cost 100k perhaps) a shop for rare items and ect.
I'm all for adding new game features and a way to use money. However, getting an illegal license doesn't sound like a bad idea either. You can buy it at a discounted rate. But it raises suspicion? Perhaps sometimes it doesn't work 100% and gives girls a random negative trait?
But then the tax idea isn't too bad either... instead of a tax collector coming by though, you'd just have it deducted from the pay of each encounter maybe 10%? So slaves would make 10% less than a girl without the tattoo.
I dunno, I like the license idea better. Something you have to keep up with, something you have to deal with YOURSELF. Managing girls and gangs is all well and good, but come on. Give me something else every once in a while.
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Well, according to the flavor text, the slave tattoo is magical, which gives me this idea: It needs a "mage" to apply it, so at first you'll need to hire someone to apply the slave brand for, say, 200-300 gold per slave (and the girls have to willingly submit to being branded, unless you pay a bribe for a "no questions asked" branding). But if you get a better than average reputation, you can apply to learn to do the branding yourself. Say a one time fee of 5000 gold and taking up all your talk actions for a few weeks, and after that you can brand your girls yourself at no cost.
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Here's what I think slaving should be about: lower happiness (in general), less (or, in some cases, zero) chance of refusing things or running away, less income (slaves are motivated by fear, not money, and thus perform worse - although the current disparity in incomes might be a wee bit extreme). This system would be pretty balanced, since the decrease in money is theoretically offset by the extra control, and happiness doesn't matter (well, doesn't matter so long as the girl can't run away, become addicted to drugs, or suicide - at least two of which should definately be limited by slavery, and possibly hte third as well). I would think that for the most part everyone here would agree on these - except, possibly, for the income bit, but if you don't agree with me there I'll take the high road and simply ignore you instead of telling you you're an uneducated, blathering fool that should be shot out of a cannon into a pile of broken glass, then dumped into a fish tank full of starved piranhas and muriatic acid.
Anyway, back on topic, if we are mostly agreed on the game mechanic differences between slavery and freedom, the next question is what the game mechanics should be to change from one to the other. Obviously, there should be a punishment of some kind to prevent players from switching girls from one to the other too often, because what sane person is going to stay that way when they are constantly and repeatedly 'freed' then branded into slavery. Damn. Now, I actually think the current punishment is probably enough - the happiness hit is less important than the health hit, which at least forces a time delay in the process. Having money be involved isn't necessary; whether it should be invoved anyway is... dicey. I, personally, think not, but that's mostly because - gasp! - it's never been done that way before - endgasp.
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THis is a very interesting idea. What about also including a way to purchace slaves illegally.
Like after you aquire enough territory your organization discovers a way to get into an illegal slave market. Which offers slaves with differant abilliites from Legal slaves but you need to be careful about not letting the guards find them.
Also I had an idea about when you get those males where you can brand them and immediatly sell them to the market.
I had an idea that why not also give the option of using them in your organization for various tasks. Like use the new male slave as a grunt, or a money launderer, Caseno acountant, or any number of jobs. Kind of like having your own network of agents forced to do your bidding. This would also play alot into their loyaltyt to you. Some you could get their loyalty by the threat of turning his family into slaves if he doesn't work for your.
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Here's what I think slaving should be about: lower happiness (in general), less (or, in some cases, zero) chance of refusing things or running away, less income (slaves are motivated by fear, not money, and thus perform worse - although the current disparity in incomes might be a wee bit extreme). This system would be pretty balanced, since the decrease in money is theoretically offset by the extra control, and happiness doesn't matter (well, doesn't matter so long as the girl can't run away, become addicted to drugs, or suicide - at least two of which should definately be limited by slavery, and possibly hte third as well). ...
Given that I almost never have a free girl become addicted to drugs (When I have drugs in the item file), commit suicide, or run away when I'm not trying to brand them, you're basically making it to where having slaves is completely pointless.
If slaves earn less, then they should get a significant boost because you already have to pay to purchase them. Therefore, slaves should earn as much as free girls and have a lower chance of refusal.
Maybe set it to where the amount a girl earns is dependent on her happiness: if you treat your slave or free woman poorly, she earns less.
However, slaves still have the same potential for happiness as free women. If you make it otherwise, you get into the massive array of a large number of traits that would change max happiness.
'Broken Will', 'Mind Fucked', 'Dependent', and 'Meek' would eliminate any cap on happiness in any girl, free or slave, while traits like 'aggressive', 'merciless', 'tsundere', 'sadistic', or a bunch of other ones denoting strong willed or aggressive girls would drastically reduce the cap on happiness because the girls, free or enslaved but more so free, would not like to work as a prostitute.
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I think if we define the culture of the society a bit (as it pertains to slaves) then we can settle this argument somewhat. If Crossgate has a slavery culture similar to the southern US, pre-civil war, then slaves should most definitely take huge penalties to happiness and their "productivity" per unit time should be reduced, though they would have no free will to refuse working at all, on punishment of severe beating of themselves, their families, their friends, and/or random other slaves. They would not be permitted to retain any identity not given to them by their masters. They have no legal or property rights. They are treated as animals: bought, sold, and bred as such. I would strongly prefer that this not be the model we use.
In some other cultures, slaves were afforded legal and property rights, along with a social standing commensurate with their owner's. The slaves of a nobleman may well be higher in social standing than the average freemen. In such societies, there may not be a stigma associated with being a slave, especially if slaves are generally well treated by their owners. Some people may willingly sell themselves into slavery (to pay family debts, for example); they give a lifetime of service in exchange for the guarantee of their basic needs being met (food, clothing, shelter). In pre-modern civilizations, the average freeman was far from guaranteed to meet his basic needs, nevermind those of his family, so becoming a slave in exchange for a guarantee was a pretty good deal for many. Many such societies gave slaves property rights as well, and high status slaves often owned slaves themselves (rather common, I'm given to understand, in the Roman empire). Under such a system, slavery becomes a social contract, which happens to be easier for one party to break than the other. I vastly prefer such a system (it also fits the fantasy-esque setting much better, IMNSHO).
The second option doesn't preclude forcing or coercing people into slavery against their will, but it also doesn't reduce slaves to the status of animals. One can be quite happy as a slave and terrified of the responsibility of being free in such a system.
The second system also has the convenience of eliminating most of the issues brought up so far. There would be no need to change how happiness and the PC[emotion] stats are calculated, the rebelliousness functions, how traits are applied, etc. The only fix needed is to equalize the amount charged per customer for slaves and free girls with the same stats. It also would let us write scripts where the girls willingly become slaves (either by asking the player or vice-versa).
I'm not trying to remake slavery into a positive thing, just less horrific.
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Honestly, I like to look at it the other way around - not "let's find ways to penalize slaves," but instead "let's find ways to make free girls better."
I mean, you have to figure that in a city like Crossgate, which is explicitly stated to be run by criminals, the rule is basically "might makes right;" slavery has to be incredibly widespread. It should be the norm for a brothel owner, and a free whore should be a rare thing indeed.
So why free your girls? Well, for one thing it makes them very happy - they see slaves every single day, and get reminded that their lives can't be all bad - at least they're not slaves, right? - giving a daily (small) bonus to Happiness and PCLove. For another, they know full well that they have to do good work in the brothel, or else there's always the threat of being enslaved and sold off; they should have a lower chance to refuse to work. Also, their greater freedom should make the Free Time "job" more effective; for them, it really is free time, as opposed to a slave's free time, which is still within certain strict limits imposed by their owner. Maybe only free girls are permitted to carry weapons, too?
In Crossgate, slavery should be everywhere. It's the default. There's no sense in sugar-coating it, I figure. so don't penalize it; just make the alternative more attractive, nice little bonuses in exchange for the loss of complete control.
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I don't think anyone is suggesting we penalize slaves - they are already less preferable to free girls, which is the problem.
From an economic standpoint, your suggestion makes no sense whatsoever. Slaves cost money to acquire, free girls don't, ergo there must be a tangible benefit to owning slaves, or slave ownership doesn't happen.
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First of all, I see the choice to keep your girls as slaves or otherwise as being largely a role-playing issue. I think the two should be balance closely enough that there isn't really a gameplay advantage of one over the other.
This is the way I'd like to see it work. Some of this is already in place, some of it is bugged, and some needs implementing. In an ideal world, however:
- Support: Slaves work for free, and you can keep them in kennels should you so choose. Free girls demand reasonable accommodation, and decent living conditions. If they don't get these things, happiness should plummet, leading to refusal to work and walking out.
- Disposition: Keeping free girls is the "good" thing to do, and improves your reputation around town
- Happiness: Free girls tend to be happier
- Recruitment: You can buy slaves from the market. This is the only way to get girls which is fast, reliable, and risk-free. Acquiring free women should need some sort of recruitment drive, which is also going to cost money. I don't think kidnapping should be a reliable way to recruit girls, and snatching free women off the street and telling them they have to whore for you should definitely be a risky proposition. Monster girls should be hard to get (need to fix the catacomb bug) and doubly risky as a source of free whores.
- Ownership: You own slaves and can sell them. When they run away you can hunt them down and drag them back again. If a free woman leaves your employ, there is nothing you can do about it. It is her right.
- Obedience: Slaves should obey more often than free girls, although they won't be happy about doing it. Free girls can refuse to work. You can punish both for disobedience, but an unhappy free girl may leave your employ.
- Money: Slaves may own money and property, but only at the indulgence of their master. All girls should go shopping if they have the cash, but free girls will have more money to buy things to make themselves more attractive. This means that free girls should need less micromanagement.
- Drugs: Slaves are less happy, and so more prone to drugs when available. Free girls are more likely to have the funds to buy them, however.
I don't think that's too badly slanted either way. Also, bear in mind that when I get done with this ongoing finance re-write, you'll be able to adjust slave prices and the like, so there should be plenty of scope to rebalanced things in keeping with your personal vision, if you don't much care for mine.
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What about also having wages for the free girls. Since they aren't slaves you would likely need to pay them more than slaves. It could start getting expensive if you have large numbers of free girls so it would make the player try to limit how many free girls he has in his brothels.
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What about also having wages for the free girls. Since they aren't slaves you would likely need to pay them more than slaves. It could start getting expensive if you have large numbers of free girls so it would make the player try to limit how many free girls he has in his brothels.
Probably not, since they're on commission. Although they might want paying if they do something like casino duty where they don't get any income themselves.
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Yeah, there probably should be a "minimum wage" sort of thing for free girls. Also, I think we should have the opportunity to track down free girls who have left our employ, with options to rehire them (at a much higher rate than before) or drag them in kicking and screaming for branding as a slave.
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Or if a free girls is caught skimming from the top. Or leaking info to another group you get the option to drag them into the dungion for branding.
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Also, I think we should have the opportunity to track down free girls who have left our employ, with options to rehire them (at a much higher rate than before) or drag them in kicking and screaming for branding as a slave.
I think I would want the second option to be an risky and/or expensive undertaking, I think. Possibly damaging your influence, and trigging some nasty raids. I'm not averse to the idea of dragging them back for branding (I'd want to do it myself) but there should be some risk involved.
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Of course there should be risk involved. Any time you do something illegal (which, presumably, branding a free girl as a slave without just cause is), there should be risks, commensurate with the level of illegality and mitigated by the degree to which you can cover them up.
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correct me if i'm wrong but don't you have a payment inherent in the fact that free girls only hand in 60% of their takings where slave girls are per default set to 100% ?
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That's right. But some jobs don't generate income directly. They don't take a % of the movie money, for instance. Or from the gambling pool at the casino. They do get food and board in any case, of course, but so do slaves.
I'm kind of 50/50 on the question, all told.
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correct me if i'm wrong but don't you have a payment inherent in the fact that free girls only hand in 60% of their takings where slave girls are per default set to 100% ?
The percent take is a commission (like what a car salesman earns when he sells a car), whereas paying them directly would be a wage. Wages are flat with respect to how many customers show up in a given week (in the case of our game), and so represent a stable income stream for girls. There are currently enormous income gaps between jobs in WM: whores bring in tons of cash, which is attributed to the girls directly (and so a commission-based payment system makes sense); strip bar work is a mixed bag, part of the money is directly attributable to a girl, while the rest comes in terms of increased customers for whores, so a mixed commission- and wage-based system makes sense; casino workers have no directly attributable cash flow, but they bring in customers for the whores, so a wage-based payment system makes the most sense. I don't know if income from movies gets attributed to the girls or not; if it isn't, then wages make sense.
Of course, this might be way above the level of fine-tuning that players will want to do (I know MBA's who scratch their heads when I talk about this stuff with them, so it's probably too realistic for our purposes).
What if we simply change the whole system over to wages? Wages are easy to understand - you know what you are paying, and girls know what they are receiving. Then we can easily assign wage tiers for each job (Unskilled, Amateur, Skilled, Professional, and Superstar), differentiate between jobs (say, strippers are paid less than whores), and assign scalar multipliers for difficulty and for girl demands (a girl could come to you asking for a 5% raise, which is easily handled by using a 1.05x multiplier to the appropriate wage rate).
Thoughts?
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That'd work rather well, I think. I'd vote for it.
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I think wages are fine for strippers and casino workers, as long as they can get tips (especially for those girls who have sex on the side). But I also think the the per-act pay for actual prostitutes needs to remain distinct, at least in part because the idea of a whore on salary feels bizarre to me.
I was going to put in suggestions for the sex-work pay system here, but the tale grew in the telling, so to speak, and I'll make a new thread for it when I'm done thinking it out.
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The whore wages could be per customer, rather than per shift, but that leaves open the possibility that girls could still have zero customers and thus have zero earnings.
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Well, as far as I know that's kind of how prostitution works. They call 'em sex workers, not standing-around workers. Heheh.
That said, yeah, I could see the value in some sort of minimum wage required for free girls, a retainer fee maybe, just to keep them around in case you don't do a good enough job of attracting sufficient customers to make it worth their time. As an optional thing affecting the good/evil alignment, maybe?
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I just don't think it's reasonable that you could convince hundreds of equally-skilled (once fully trained) girls to accept the income differential that currently exists between whores, strippers, and everyone else in the game. As it stands now, whores closest to the top of the girl list make vastly larger sums of money than those further down the list, but even the lowest earning whore (aside from those who never see any clients at all) outclasses the highest paid stripper in your employ.
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Thoughts?
It seems logical and consistent. My main concern is that it's a lot of work for (probably) not very much return in terms of gameplay. I'll also admit to liking the % system as it stands.
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if you want your girls to be able to buy stuff for self improvement then you need to put in a basic stipend in addition to the %, nothing too high but enough to be able to save for those nice new high heels.
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I'll think about it and see what I can come up with.
In some ways, it might be easier to let people set a weekly wage for their girls, irrespective of what they've been doing that week.
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How about a pet rank. It could be technically be both a high and low one.
The pet slave will likely have the rank of a personal pet but all the employees are required to look after the pet and anyone assigned to take care of her is the pet's body guard and such.
Also it would be interesting if there was also a special shop as well for slaves specially trained to be pet's. the Different of pet type is dependant on what pet type was ingraned into the slave's mind. You could even have that the player could train his slaves into pets but it's a lengthy process to brainwash the slave into a pet. You also would need different of equipment and furnishings for each pet type.
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.... whore master viva pinata... lol... on whore wages, we already do pay them wages if you count room and board. I think it subtracts money for each girls accommodation level each turn. So paying them extra cash wages isn't needed, since they have no bills, all the cash they keep is 100 profit for them. I would however alter it so all girls get to keep their tips, including slaves by default. You can always be an evil prick and take their cash if you want.
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Not digging the pet idea. Slaves certainly don't need wages either. Letting them have the tips isn't a bad idea though.
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Not digging the pet idea. Slaves certainly don't need wages either. Letting them have the tips isn't a bad idea though.
Depends on what we mean by "pet" I guess. I was thinking of it in the sense of personal sex slave, rather than training puppygirls and the like. Keeping a small number of slaves at the player's house so you can play tamagotchi games with them was an offhand comment from necno a while back. All I was thinking was: if we are going to have a mechanism like that, it might be fairly simple to script it to handle servants and the like. And probably mentally conditioned petgirls as well, come to that. I doubt there'll be anything built directly into the game in this regard, but I'll gladly see about adding the hooks so modders can do it.
Tips sounds like a good thought. I can put that in the config file.
Wages, I have mixed feelings about. From a game mechanic viewpoint, we don't need them. Exodia got it spot on. From a simulation viewpoint on the other hand, I'd expect girls who pull barmaid or teacher duty for six months solid to become envious of their colleagues having sex and making money every night. Which may be a good way to handle it: no wages, but girls may become unhappy if they don't get the occasional bit of income. Other than that, I'd rate good gameplay as more important that accurate simulation 99 times out of 100, so again, that says "no wages" to me.
Bit of a ramble there. Brain still waking up
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I got the idea from reading a hypno comic.
I mean a girl who has no normal human will.
This girl type could be a unique commodity that is mainly used for selling. They are a little difficult to make but can be sold for higher prices than it takes for you to make them. You can also make something like a pet trading center where you load the pet slaves to others for a constant income.
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I mean a girl who has no normal human will.
Meek, Dependent, Mind-Fucked... these all seem to fit the bill of what you're talking about without the need for an entirely new category of slave, methinks.
Also, this is where I once again suggest the acronym of KISS - Keep It Simple, Stupid! Too many options and too much micromanagement makes a fun game stop being a fun game and start being, y'know, work. :)
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This girl type could be a unique commodity that is mainly used for selling. They are a little difficult to make but can be sold for higher prices than it takes for you to make them. You can also make something like a pet trading center where you load the pet slaves to others for a constant income.
I think it's a cool idea and would make a good subject for an event, or for maybe for a mod like the Abby's Crossing one I want to make some day. The game has a lot of the bits you'd need to make it work, and I'm planning on adding the rest, before too much longer.
That said, I can't see us coding it into the base game any time soon.
Let me get the Lua integration sorted out and we can revisit the idea. Maybe get a mod project started :)
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I think a good way to increase the importance of slaves is actually add a cost of life, for example you give your slaves food boarding and medicine, and i suppose you own their houses, have a cook and a doctor in your ranks(even if it is not stated explicitly). So how about adding a base value multiplied by a random number to denote the economical situation of the city and thus the cost of life. Then you could fix their accommodations to a certain level of income, this would decrease happiness when the prices are high and make them happy when they are low, and it can somewhat be fixed by decreasing your share in their earnings. On the other hand keep the housing situation of slaves as it is now completely under player control. That way you can micromanage the happiness of slaves while the happiness of free girls depends on your share of the earnings and the world.
That way you can make free girls more random as they are in reality, while as you take care of most if not all necessities of your slaves, their lives are quite stable. Also it would be good idea to add traits like greedy or luxurious, so if a girl find the pay isn't enough to get the livehood level they want they may spontaneously quit.
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Going back to the slave license thing. It does sound interesting when mixed with the idea that zodiac44 had earlier about some people willingly becoming slaves. Gonna sound odd and probably rather code intensive, but how about 4-5 types of girls. Free girls/Market or Regular slave girls (Legal+Registered)/Contracted Slaves (People who offer themselves for shelter/food/debt and is legal)/Monster girls/Illegal Slaves (girls you kidnap and forcibly brand). The license could be a 'registration fee' *coughbribecough* to convert your Illegal Slaves to regular slaves so if you are raided you are not fined for them and can sell them. (you cant tell me such a corrupt gov would not keep track of slaves for possible income *coughblackmailcough* purposes). Also maybe have to purchase licenses for certain acts/jobs. (ex. Tentacle monster keeping license, License to keep monster girls legally - seein as they are liable to tear someone apart if they go berserk, Movie Production license, Alcohol license, Gambling License, Stripping license, various others too.) You COULD choose to do the acts w/o the licenses, but if caught you could be fined and lose rep. Also would have the added bonus of making the 'bribery' option at city hall more useful since gives even more reason for gov not to go snooping around your businesses. By having the licenses it would improve your rep or something.
Perhaps the 'take a walk' action in town could have a few different options added to it as to where you take that walk. Say you walk through the slums and find a starving girl on the streets with no money/home and she offers herself as a slave (which would be legally free as a 'contract'). Also a wealthier part of town with bored rich daughters wanting to rebel against their parents or something willing to work as free girls. Maybe 3-4 areas of town you can choose to 'walk' and search, with certain areas having better chances of finding girls but lower quality or something.
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Here's a thought on the topic of cost of life.
how have some situations where you have girls that are less independant and more lossed in the head to be cheaper. Those would likely not do many tasks that would cost more money aside from food, shelter, and medical care.
Also I do like the idea of having some girls voluntarily becomming slaves so they could be fed and such. It would offer an interesting side to the story.
Also I had a though of an event. Why not have an event where your kidnapped and then almost enslaved by some nut girl then you eventually get an option to do the same to her after a terf war with her gang. I mean if you can do it to others it maybe a good idea to have some close calls for your character as well.
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Here's a thought on the topic of cost of life.
how have some situations where you have girls that are less independant and more lossed in the head to be cheaper. Those would likely not do many tasks that would cost more money aside from food, shelter, and medical care.
Also I do like the idea of having some girls voluntarily becomming slaves so they could be fed and such. It would offer an interesting side to the story.
Also I had a though of an event. Why not have an event where your kidnapped and then almost enslaved by some nut girl then you eventually get an option to do the same to her after a terf war with her gang. I mean if you can do it to others it maybe a good idea to have some close calls for your character as well.
...It would be funnier if the government did a raid at the moment she tried to, caught her trying to brand you illegally without a license, and arrested her. Then you could decide to buy her from them and brand her yourself legally.
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It could also follow with some annoying antics for the characters. Like the psyco keep's thinking of her as the main character's superior and keeps trying to disaplin him.
Like a character who is a conceeded nutjob.
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When the scripting system is fixed/rewritten/whatever Doc is planning, this kind of stuff should be easy enough to do.
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I like a lot of the ideas here. A "rival" of sorts... or rather some girl who claims to be your rival could be really interesting event or rather several events. I would think of her as more of a comedic addition to the game at first and once you progress within her line of events she'll become a nuisance. Kind of like Mid-boss in Disgaea I would think. You can even give her an underling.
I'm really excited to see an improved scripting system. Would be nice to single out story characters or event images to another folder, the characters folder is getting pretty full!
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Or even better a jot job that keeps thinking of you as her destened slave, almost no matter what you do.