devolution

Author Topic: Stat system rework  (Read 11359 times)

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Offline mika

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Re: Stat system rework
« Reply #15 on: June 28, 2015, 04:21:48 PM »
Stop mutilating my posts by cutting them into snippets, then arranging the snippets in a way that implies things i never said.

Quote and reply to arguments in full context, instead of building strawmans.

I will not discuss with sophists.

EDIT: As for my aggressive tone right now - i do not respond well to dishonesty and lies.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2015, 04:26:40 PM by mika »

Offline 0nymous

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Re: Stat system rework
« Reply #16 on: June 28, 2015, 04:29:58 PM »
Stop mutilating my posts by cutting them into snippets, then arranging the snippets in a way that implies things i never said.

Quote and reply to arguments in full context, instead of building strawmans.

I will not discuss with sophists.

EDIT: As for my aggressive tone right now - i do not respond well to dishonesty and lies.
How's this for a strawman:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4goUqiOL44


Also, I don't think "sophist" means what you think it means...
« Last Edit: June 28, 2015, 04:32:31 PM by 0nymous »

Offline mika

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Re: Stat system rework
« Reply #17 on: June 28, 2015, 04:58:00 PM »
ORLY sophist?

Let's recap my statements in the proper order and context:

This is what i proposed in the OP:
Quote
The proper fix is, to make it so that girls can do incomplete shifts, or do them at reduced quality. For a brothel whore, the former would mean she will stop accepting customers, when passing beyond say 75% tiredness. The later would mean she does the shift at lower quality, in return for less tiredness.

I prefer the second approach - reduced quality - because it can be implemented without burdening the player with an additional option ("Drive her hard" vs "Go easy on her"): Make it so that the more tired a girl becomes - PER CUSTOMER, NOT PER SHIFT - the lower the quality of her work becomes, and the less her tiredness increases from work. This makes the ability to do work basically a "soft cap": Girls that lack constitution can do two shifts, but their work would be of lesser quality.
Summary for the illiterate: No interface changes proposed. Instead i'm putting two options on the table: First, respond to tiredness on a per-customer instead of per-shift basis. Second: The more tired a girl is, the lower the quality of her work becomes, and the less effort (tiredness), she spents on her work - again PER CUSTOMER.

I conclude that i would prefer the SECOND OPTION, because the FIRST OPTION (First does not mean second, just so you understand), might result in the need of an extra UI "slider" to set at what tiredness level a girl should stop.

Notice: Nowhere is there a mention of changing the number of shifts. In fact, YOU were the first person to suggest changes to the number of shifts, not me. To quote from your reply (You is not me, just to make sure you understand):

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A something of a compromise-solution to the Constitution issue, that would need a complete rewrite of some core mechanics: a four shifts per day system, 6 hours each:
-morning (6.00-12:00)
-afternoon (12:00-18:00)
-evening (18:00-00:00)
-night (00:00-6:00)
The rough practical estimates of the stats would be that girls with around 25 constitution could handle one shift a day without too much Tiredness gain. Girls with 50 - two and those with 75 - three. Beautifully logical IMO.

I then responded with the following:
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About your proposal to add more shifts: I considered this, but the game already has a severe micromanagement problem. I'm spending 90% of my time with micromanaging schedules and distributing equipment. In a game that is supposedly about running MULTIPLE businesses, this is nuts. Of course, the interface is partially at fault for this, but that's not the only issue. Personally, i consider even the current two shift model already too much for the scale on which the game operates (I'd rather have just one assignment, and then a kind of setting to determine "how much" a girl works. Yet i didn't propose this, because A) I doubt the existing playerbase would agree, and B) At the time of writing, i thought things like these are already too deeply rooted in the gamecode, and its now too late to make such fundamental changes).

Just so you understand: "Didn't propose this" means that i do NOT propose it.

What DID i propose instead? For those too lazy to read the OP, i next in the same post repeated my original proposal:
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So, if neither a redesign of scheduling is on the table, and extra shifts would make micromanagement truely ludicrous, the remaining option to manage workload more finely is, to either:

1. Per girl, introduce an extra setting, to let the player modify how much or how hard a girl works.
2. Have the game someway automagickally make needed adjustments. This adjustment might on purpose not be perfect and could have downsides.

Option #1 - despite not being as complex as additional shifts - still adds more complexity. And the problem is different jobs take different effort. So, the player would constantly have to adjust this setting about how hard a girl should work, whenever the assignment is changed.

Hence, i proposed something akin to option #2: As a girl gets more tired, both the quality of her work and the effort spent decreases.

EDIT: See, no UI changes - no nothing - just girls automagickally working at lower quality and effort, as they get more tired. No, this does not neccessarily mean that a girl can work forever... less effort does not mean no effort. Overwork would still remain a problem - so you couldn't let a girl with i.e. 50 constitution do 2 shifts. But for whore jobs, in the range of 60-75 constitution, there would be a "soft cap" - a transition - where a girl can sustain two shifts, but at reduced quality, and over time probably health and happiness penalties.

KTNXBYE
« Last Edit: June 28, 2015, 05:10:01 PM by mika »

Offline 0nymous

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Re: Stat system rework
« Reply #18 on: June 28, 2015, 06:08:12 PM »

Quote
I will not discuss with sophists.

So much for that, whatever your definition of the word "sophist" is.

I guess this is the part where we could start flinging shit at each other, but whatever, dude, you win, I guess I did fail to interpret your concepts, although I could argue you're just shit at explaining them.

Your proposition is still confusing as fuck, and I don't see how it changes anything in the current gameplay aside from adding a mechanic forcing the player to micromanage girls with more varied Constitution levels. I guess it does fix the "issue" of "girls only being able to work a full shift at full effort".

As for your opposition to micromanagement I'm still waiting for propositions as to what the actual other gameplay elements WM might have.

Offline SOMEGUY789

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Re: Stat system rework
« Reply #19 on: June 30, 2015, 02:43:01 AM »

As for your opposition to micromanagement I'm still waiting for propositions as to what the actual other gameplay elements WM might have.

Honestly I think you should have more interaction with the characters and gangs working for as it is it feels kinda soulless. There's basically no reason to care about anything in the game, because you could easily get replacements and you don't really develop sentiments to anything. So I won't really care if girl A dies unless she makes the most money, which is fine considering you can play the game as that kind of person, but you can also play as someone who's not like that. Maybe add things like if a player is good they'd have a funeral for a dead character and things like that that you'd be forced to read rather than how it currently is where you read a little tiny bit dialogue of what the girls and gangs did that day.


Also
[/size]The same is not true i.e. for "looks", beauty and charisma.... because beauty and charisma mechanically make no difference, and "looks" then sum up the combination of two things, that are technically the same: Total redundancy.

Beauty is how a character looks and charisma is how well they interact with one another so the easiest solution to this would be to change "looks" to Allure, as that would be a good combination of the two. And seriously bro, chill you can ask how to make these changes and try making them yourself and see how they work you know?