General Discussion

[Xela]

In many other games an attempt to put a way too tired character to work ends up with either high chance of illness or wasted turn.

Which may be a lot easier/faster to code but suggest that a character is retarded and cannot tell when it is time to rest. It's not logical, under normal operations to have a system that sabotages itself because workers are stupid. Maybe this makes some sense for slaves but even then, we'll need more controls and a small extension where a character can act even when exhausted with penalties to the job performance and maybe even some stats.

Will be difficult for whores at very least, since they get different skills bonuses depending on acts (anal, vaginal, etc). All other jobs so far are more predictable though.

Not necessarily, we can have counters for stats already, they are also not applied on spot but at the jobs end. It would not be difficult to tweak that... I am trying to work through it in my head to figure out if it (and other proposals) is worth the effort.

==>
The system setup itself is presently quite reasonable and allows a lot of interesting events/modding at different places happening in a timely and logical manner, that setup however didn't make balancing and keeping track of stats (workers/buildings/clients) under normal operations/upgrades/event results/ and etc. any easier. It prolly even made it more difficult. I am trying to figure out how to compensate for it or even if we should do it right now or ever...

[DarkTl]

Ok, then is there a reason to have more than 1 manager per building? If no, it will be the less demanded class ever so far.

[deadkingblue]

on the front page you said you need writers, i can't write sexy stuff but interactions are something i can try. But i'd need a list with the characters, location if applicable, and how the girl reacts if applicable, and any other factors you want me to add. I am not an amazing writer but i am a writer. oh and the girls relationship with the pc changes how they react right? give me a number and explanation of the relationship if you can. ALSO i really want an updated alpha or even beta to be released to the point that i started reading python scripting books. they might as well be written in egyptian. I appreciate that you guys are actively developing this though.

[Xela]

Ok, then is there a reason to have more than 1 manager per building? If no, it will be the less demanded class ever so far.

I've been puzzling about that myself for some time. It ended with the decision of having one for now and maybe more later under one of these designed:

1) Main manager and requirement for sub-manager for every x amount of building resources (like rooms or tables).

2) Workers themselves that have a manager as one of their main classes add to management in general.

===>
Since we do not have a management routine yet (we have the main manager spot + one or two test cases for it), I don't know how we'll proceed in the future. It doesn't really matter if there is high demand for it or not. I want to add a simple recruitment agency that can look for unique or create random worker on your request, what can be requested by the player specifically will prolly be limited and depend on level, rep, fame, owned businesses and etc.

[DarkTl]

Irl you need more managers if you have a lot of workers or multiple departments. So if bonuses provided by managers will be limited by the number of affected characters or occupation (manager for cleaners, manager for guards, etc), they will be more needed in the game. I don't propose the latter one as subclasses, there will be one manager class, and you will be able to set her to one of occupations.

[Xela]

on the front page you said you need writers, i can't write sexy stuff but interactions are something i can try. But i'd need a list with the characters, location if applicable, and how the girl reacts if applicable, and any other factors you want me to add. I am not an amazing writer but i am a writer. oh and the girls relationship with the pc changes how they react right? give me a number and explanation of the relationship if you can. ALSO i really want an updated alpha or even beta to be released to the point that i started reading python scripting books. they might as well be written in egyptian. I appreciate that you guys are actively developing this though.

Knowing some Python is an advantage but not a huge one, there are dozens of working examples of almost anything in script already and a lot of stuff that is used often has been simplified and generalized.

The whole project is open sourced so you don't really need a release, just to figure out how to:

1) Download and unpack Ren'Py Dev Kit (simple download and unrar/unzip), you can also get it as an installer I think.

2) Getting the code base + resources:

- Download and install a Git software of your choice (we're using git extensions).
- Pulling the repo into Ren'Py project folder, you don't even need a permission for that from our repository.

or

- Plainly going to our repo page and downloading the whole repo manually. (very simple but ineffective because you cannot update it)

3) Getting some packs, you at the very least need one random pack. Preferably, it's wise to have Naruto, One Piece and all random packs and unpacking them to char/rchar dirs.

4) Starting Ren'Py launcher and launching the game.

5) Maybe you'll need my testing.rpy file as well, I structured the code for game to work without it but may have f*cked up somewhere because Dark had issues without it.

==>
It looks like a lot but it's simpler than it sounds and we should have more specific examples somewhere (I hope that we do). If you're willing to mess with this, you can get the code, if not, this is prolly the least required to effectively work on the project.

Without being able to code in Python, you can do this with the repo setup:

- Fix bad (at places really bad) English.
- Add new events/text of all kinds based on already existing and sometimes well commented code.
- Add new interactions.
- Expanding existing events/storyline.
- Coming up with new concepts/suggestion on how to enrich old once if you figure out how stuff is working at least in general.

All of that is a lot harder without the dev version setup... you can always write text/events. It's hard without knowing the game but it was done before couple of time, Dark or I put the events/texts into the game afterwards, sometimes even manage to request something specific

[Xela]

Irl you need more managers if you have a lot of workers or multiple departments. So if bonuses provided by managers will be limited by the number of affected characters or occupation (manager for cleaners, manager for guards, etc), they will be more needed in the game. I don't propose the latter one as subclasses, there will be one manager class, and you will be able to set her to one of occupations.

I am hoping that we'll see the best way to do this as code and relevant interface matures...

[Xela]

I just hooked up my laptop to a large TV, BE looks really good there! Some mistimings are a bit more apparent too

[DarkTl]

How do you imagine building structure?

I thought about possible options:
- every building could maintain a limited amount of establishments. It has nothing to do with the number of rooms or upgrades. For example, in the cheapest, smallest building there will be enough for 1 establishments. An establishment is stuff like brothel, bar, stripclub, etc.
- we could use real time building like Alkion used to have (dunno if it still has it), where you build rooms like, well, in Dungeon Keeper if you ever played it, by clicking on squares of the building map. I kinda liked that option, even though it should be coded much better than it was coded in Alkion.
- living rooms must be used by slaves if you have any, and could be used by homeless or poor free chars if you allow them. In the latter case they will rest much better than at home, and will have some disposition bonuses.

[Xela]

- every building could maintain a limited amount of establishments. It has nothing to do with the number of rooms or upgrades. For example, in the cheapest, smallest building there will be
enough for 1 establishments. An establishment is stuff like brothel, bar, stripclub, etc.

I didn't think of limiting the amount of establishments (in code, they are called Upgrades). Right now they plainly require space (internal/external).

- we could use real time building like Alkion used to have (dunno if it still has it), where you build rooms like, well, in Dungeon Keeper if you ever played it, by clicking on squares of the building map. I kinda liked that option, even though it should be coded much better than it was coded in Alkion.

I can code it much better but we'll run into issues with graphical resources really fast. It is never too late for this (just like it was with Alkion).

- living rooms must be used by slaves if you have any, and could be used by homeless or poor free chars if you allow them. In the latter case they will rest much better than at home, and will have some disposition bonuses.

I am already planning that but all free chars will have their own housing. We will not bother with quality of that form the Beta.

How do you imagine building structure?

Building ==> Upgrade ==> Sub-Upgrade.

I am not 100% sure about code structure for all of this yet, Upgrades are ready but I have a few excellent ideas for Subs, I just don't know if it sensible to bother with the complex stuff yet. I wrote some new code for jobs, maybe I should switch to SE for a while like we did with BE to let the new code/concepts settle down a little bit before we continue hacking at jobs again...

I want to finish assigning managers tonight at any rate.

[Xela]

One thing I didn't think off is what to do when the Manager is resting... we prolly want to keep base bonuses from having a manager active and at the managers ability but personal effect that the manager brings should be inactive.

[deadkingblue]

Did some english homework on the xeona dialogues. Also i think i need the testing rpy you mentioned where can i find that (cause the glitches were unruly due to none specified variables). also called her leona alot in my change log.

[deadkingblue]

Also some of my notes in the changelog may have been writers bias, so if my changes don't match the ideal tone of the game let me know. And don't let my suggestions and comments offend you  

[Xela]

Did some english homework on the xeona dialogues. Also i think i need the testing rpy you mentioned where can i find that (cause the glitches were unruly due to none specified variables). also called her leona alot in my change log.

I'll see if I can get around to reading it tonight. I cannot send you testing.rpy at the moment because it is added in such a way that it prevent your game from starting until you update the code with manager assignment and that is not pushed (or ready yet) at the moment.

Also some of my notes in the changelog may have been writers bias, so if my changes don't match the ideal tone of the game let me know. And don't let my suggestions and comments offend you  

Noted 

[Xela]

Did some english homework on the xeona dialogues.

Looks solid.

Also i think i need the testing rpy you mentioned where can i find that (cause the glitches were unruly due to none specified variables).

I'll attach my testing.rpy to this post but I don't think that was an issue, from the look of the first error, you tried to run the game using packs from Alpha (which you cannot do). Grab the new packs from Dark's pack thread, they should work. Rest of the error are most likely due to an attempt to skip the pack error.

- Average level if a team (even when a fight is 1v1, we still count them as teams internally) is used to determine if opfor agreed to fight or not (in dogfights).

- "Demeaning" acts more often than not will be handled on per case bases and calculated off traits, disposition and other stats/flags/relationship with player.

- Jobs willing to do depends on "Base Traits" concept. Slaves will do any job.

- I am not sure how we gauge give money interaction but there will be an automatic disposition popup.

- Sex acts are handled on per case basis as well, there may not even be a way to currently check which acts exactly char is willing to do because we never planned to make an easy accessible list outside of interactions (there is no class/function that we use, everything is handled in labels (I think*)).

- We will have criminal activities but not (or extremely unlikely) before the beta release.

- Dogfights are supposed to be "unofficial" in a sense that they are not advertised, tracked with ladders or planned in advance. I always imagined them happening outside of the main arena but never found a background for that. They are not "licensed" or "unlicensed", it's plainly that they are not "main events" and are just fighters sparring with one another "on spot" on their own time.

- Decay for arenarep is a good idea. Someone should start an issue in GitHub for that. The flip to negative thing should have been fixed a long time ago...

- Hgehe wasn't a typo but it's not a big thing either.

- Some notes:

*You most definitely don't have to explain every single change you make in separate file, if something is unclear or you can't figure if some cr@ppy thing was done deliberately, you can leave comments in the file itself. Explanations why something was changed are not needed unless it feels like it's appropriate to leave one.
*You prolly should make an account at GitHub and figure out how to push/pull stuff. I can add you to the team if you get yourself an account. You could have simply pushed the file without any added effort.

Edit:

Forgot to attach the file yesterday (it was late, in fact it was "early today" ).