Game Design/Ideas

[DarkTl]

Do you really think we need this?

I think gold and exp should be excluded from the effect of cmax field. There are other ways to balace them out. If you disagree, be my guest and add a separate cmax field for each stat 

Maybe once per 2 - 4 days at random?

Yup, sounds nice.

I still don't get this

What exactly?

we cannot really display scars so we might be better off without them completely.

You have a point there. On the other hand, we cannot leave serious damage without consequences, and trait/effect like "damage to internal organs" sounds stupid.

I completely missed collected trait so I have no idea what you're talking about but I understand the requirement of the effect well enough, what should I call it?

Self-control maybe. Or composure.

Are we going to add food/drugs before 1.0 as a major feature or as a couple of random items? We can add these effects after we decide on that.

I consider food and drinks as the main direction of spending money for girls. Irl you don't buy dress, weapons, furniture, equipment every day (except for shopaholics, yeah). But you buy food and drinks every or almost every day.
We already have a lot of food, and will have more. I guess drugs and alcohol could wait until 1.0, but food is already there.

I am really looking forward to sneaking some basic battles into the game

Then we probably need xml or json for mobs. Rm girls should be enough for testing, but not for 1.0.

[DarkTl]

Maybe it's just my personal thing, but "Fleet of foot" doesn't sound to me like opposite to dawdler. I would prefer something like "hyperactive".

Noted.

[Xela]

I think gold and exp should be excluded from the effect of cmax field. There are other ways to balace them out. If you disagree, be my guest and add a separate cmax field for each stat 

While adding this, I found a number of flaws in items system, both in code and design. Everything is fixed except for a conflict between cmax and ctemp. Game does not track which stats were modified so when temporary consumable runs through it's course, all effects are simply reversed. That is a problem if a number of it's effects were blocked and on reversal, character simply gets a penalty for no reason.

I've disabled any cmax effect if item is temporary consumable to fix this, we'll see if we need a more complex functionality in the future.

What exactly?

The whole thing. Can you just name the effect and tell me exactly what it should do?

You have a point there. On the other hand, we cannot leave serious damage without consequences, and trait/effect like "damage to internal organs" sounds stupid.
Self-control maybe. Or composure.

I don't remember a single game that I liked where serious damage left consequences. Also in most anime, after the character is beat into the pump, recovery time is usually... well hours/days tops...

Self-control maybe. Or composure.

Oki

I consider food and drinks as the main direction of spending money for girls. Irl you don't buy dress, weapons, furniture, equipment every day (except for shopaholics, yeah). But you buy food and drinks every or almost every day.

Alright, there is other stuff and as far as money spending, text: She went for a girls night out with close friends. Or went to a restaurant or spent some cash placing bets in Arena and so on go a long way as well. There is NO REASON what so ever to create a black hole for expenditures with items.

We already have a lot of food, and will have more. I guess drugs and alcohol could wait until 1.0, but food is already there.
Then we probably need xml or json for mobs. Rm girls should be enough for testing, but not for 1.0.

No problem, it will be simpler after there is some form of a system at place and I have a clearer picture on what we need to specify in JSON/XML files.

[DarkTl]

The whole thing. Can you just name the effect and tell me exactly what it should do?

Depression when joy is <10, maybe <15. On a roll (or any synonym you find more suitable) when joy is more than 90. Effects are -5 and +5% to daily income, providing that the girl has a job with income.

I don't remember a single game that I liked where serious damage left consequences. Also in most anime, after the character is beat into the pump, recovery time is usually... well hours/days tops...

I recall some kind of agreement to relate to anime/shows only to a certain point 
There are also anime/games not related to fighting at all, characters from them cannot regenerate in a few hours.
I have nothing against removing scars as long as there is a suitable replacement for them.

Alright, there is other stuff and as far as money spending, text: She went for a girls night out with close friends. Or went to a restaurant or spent some cash placing bets in Arena and so on go a long way as well. There is NO REASON what so ever to create a black hole for expenditures with items.

Actually, this way player could avoid micromanagement if he wants to, since girls just could, for example, buy food item that increases joy a little when her joy is a little low and she has some spare money. And if player prefer to do it by himself, he could buy this item and use it on someone by himself.

[Xela]

Depression when joy is <10, maybe <15. On a roll (or any synonym you find more suitable) when joy is more than 90. Effects are -5 and +5% to daily income, providing that the girl has a job with income.

I really dislike this. Better option would be for a girl with joy below 30 to get disposition penalty until that is low enough to leave your service or try to run away/commit suicide if girl is a slave.

I recall some kind of agreement to relate to anime/shows only to a certain point 
There are also anime/games not related to fighting at all, characters from them cannot regenerate in a few hours.
I have nothing against removing scars as long as there is a suitable replacement for them.

We were talking about background stories and powers but even in games... I still cannot recall one that I've enjoyed having similar concept.

Actually, this way player could avoid micromanagement if he wants to, since girls just could, for example, buy food item that increases joy a little when her joy is a little low and she has some spare money. And if player prefer to do it by himself, he could buy this item and use it on someone by himself.

There is a whole mess of logic here to consider, this is a separate and possibly more complicated discussion than effects.

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I am going to finish the Unstable effect and call it quits, headache is killing me.

[DarkTl]

I really dislike this. Better option would be for a girl with joy below 30 to get disposition penalty until that is low enough to leave your service or try to run away/commit suicide if girl is a slave.

I'd prefer to have some kind of positive effect for high enough joy as well.

We were talking about background stories and powers but even in games... I still cannot recall one that I've enjoyed having similar concept.

Are you telling me you didn't enjoy wm and wm ex? There you could get scars in the dungeon and catacombs both.

this is a separate and possibly more complicated discussion than effects.

Not really. After eating, let's say, 10 items with "food" type during one day there should be a food poisoning temporary effect for a couple of days. With penalty to health and fatigue.
This way you cannot completely replace potions by food.

[Xela]

I'd prefer to have some kind of positive effect for high enough joy as well.

Sure thing.

Are you telling me you didn't enjoy wm and wm ex? There you could get scars in the dungeon and catacombs both.

WM I liked enough to dedicate what will end up in more than 1k hours into learning python/renpy/programming/development but definitely not because of a really small chance to get scars in catacombs

Not really. After eating, let's say, 10 items with "food" type during one day there should be a food poisoning temporary effect for a couple of days. With penalty to health and fatigue.
This way you cannot completely replace potions by food.

When you put it like that, it actually sounds great. I'll code this in but all relevant items should have food as a type.

[DarkTl]

Caught a Cold should definitely not effect constitution as that stat is to important to the game. Health/Fatigue/Joy are fair game, also we do not have Moon Phase Calendar, not Date Calendar This effect should also go away after 5 - 10 days and never cause health go below 50.

Btw, there could be characters that already have 50 or less max health according to xml/json. Maybe it should never cause health go below 50%?

WM I liked enough to dedicate what will end up in more than 1k hours into learning python/renpy/programming/development but definitely not because of a really small chance to get scars in catacombs

Lol 
Ok, what about characters that already have scars according to the source?

[CherryWood]

Ok, what about characters that already have scars according to the source?

Maybe adding another trait "Old scars" that isn't acquired in combat routine and not healed in same way as fresh ones?

[Xela]

Btw, there could be characters that already have 50 or less max health according to xml/json. Maybe it should never cause health go below 50%?

Characters with max health at 50 would be very bad game design at out part since most jobs revert to AutoRest at 60 health.

Lol 
Ok, what about characters that already have scars according to the source?

Scars should be used as a trait then. Since you cannot get rid of those on pics, it's a perfect trait example.

Maybe adding another trait "Old scars" that isn't acquired in combat routine and not healed in same way as fresh ones?

Yeah. but I've always hated scars in Wm for that very reason. The only girl with obvious scars that I recall was balalaika (or something like that) and getting rid if that trait through items didn't really change the pics... unless we're gonna build dolls like OW or HHS+, I see little point in scars removing items or temporary scars as they make little sense to the game and add a very limited value.

[CherryWood]

Actually, We already have Misato (NGE) with her scar visible on some pictures... that why I'm interested in it


But visual options are still there, for example, some games put a bloody reddish layer over the picture of injured character, or at least some sort of icon that represents that.

But even that wouldn't make much sense with scars, and I don't like the idea of listing injuries either...


What about representing all injuries as hit to fatigue? And post combat effects as lovering energy regeneration for some days?
It could have similar result (girl need time to heal), lovering workrate for both warriors and non warriors in same way and if we call these a "weakness" then it would not break immersion if we keep same pics even if it's a serious or permanent effect.

[Xela]

What about representing all injuries as hit to fatigue? And post combat effects as lovering energy regeneration for some days?
It could have similar result (girl need time to heal), lovering workrate for both warriors and non warriors in same way and if we call these a "weakness" then it would not break immersion if we keep same pics even if it's a serious or permanent effect.

This is about the same thing, a mess with very little reward. Lets leave scars/cool scars as traits without an option to remove them. Would make more sense to me than  forcing player to constantly deal with beat up characters, this is one of those things that really mess up the game for no good reason.

[DarkTl]

Maybe adding another trait "Old scars" that isn't acquired in combat routine and not healed in same way as fresh ones?

Well, I guess I'll replace small/usual/horrific scars with one old scars trait then. Cool scars will remain.

Would make more sense to me than  forcing player to constantly deal with beat up characters, this is one of those things that really mess up the game for no good reason.

One thing that definitely should be in the game is some kind of negative, maybe stockable effect for several days after resurrection to avoid overindulgence.

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One trait that I never understand, and because of that didn't port it, is Cool Person ("This person is just cool to be with").

Another one is Twisted ("Her thought of pleasure is not... ordinary. Customers need to have a rather exotic taste or they won't enjoy what she has in store"), this one theoretically should influence whore job a lot, otherwise it doesn't have any sense.

I never seen much difference between Cute and Charming ("This girl has a lot of natural appealing wit on her side, in a non-sexual sort of way"), because of that I leave out Charming.

Malformed, Eye Patch and One Eye I actually  never seen in wm except for random girls, but I suppose there are rare unique characters that could use them.

Do you think we need any of them?

There are also Good Kisser and Fake orgasm expert, but they are more like obtainable skills from skill tree than traits to me.

[CherryWood]

One trait that I never understand, and because of that didn't port it, is Cool Person ("This person is just cool to be with").

I never seen much difference between Cute and Charming ("This girl has a lot of natural appealing wit on her side, in a non-sexual sort of way"), because of that I leave out Charming.

I agree that we don't need them. I would personally just add more character stat points instead.

Another one is Twisted ("Her thought of pleasure is not... ordinary. Customers need to have a rather exotic taste or they won't enjoy what she has in store"), this one theoretically should influence whore job a lot, otherwise it doesn't have any sense.

I don't like this trait's description, but otherwise "Twisted" doesn't sound bad. There are some really crazy girls out there  But I have no idea what it should do.

Malformed, Eye Patch and One Eye I actually  never seen in wm except for random girls, but I suppose there are rare unique characters that could use them.

Do you think we need any of them?

I know a few characters with eye patch, but that would make more sense as item, so trait should be probably "one eye", but characters that are like that doesn't seems to be handicapped by it in the slightest, so I say we could leave it too  or just add it as a small quirk trait that doesn't really do anything

There are also Good Kisser and Fake orgasm expert, but they are more like obtainable skills from skill tree than traits to me.

Yup, sounds like that
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May I ask for your option about "optimist" trait? I have a little problems with it being all-inclusive cheerful trait. Not systemwise, but it troubles me when sorting lines for dialogues. Because I can imagine:


girl with a lot of optimism (all will be fine in the end) that is otherwise normal or even silent (more close to heroic type)
cheerful, excitable girl (usually very active), that can find fun in everything (most true to the current trait description)
childish, playful, happy girl (often naive) a personality used for many little sisters and lolis


Currently, my solution is to use excitable girl for it, put childish under optimism+lolita combination and squeeze calm optimism somewhere else, but I'm not totally sure about it.
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And another thing that I'm wondering about: I have some ripped lines that would fit for "big sis" archetype (caring, overly-protective and often giving preachings) that I would like to add, but I'm unable to figure what trait to use, or (and I would prefer that) how to name a new one.

[Xela]

May I ask for your option about "optimist" trait? I have a little problems with it being all-inclusive cheerful trait. Not systemwise, but it troubles me when sorting lines for dialogues. Because I can imagine:


girl with a lot of optimism (all will be fine in the end) that is otherwise normal or even silent (more close to heroic type)
cheerful, excitable girl (usually very active), that can find fun in everything (most true to the current trait description)
childish, playful, happy girl (often naive) a personality used for many little sisters and lolis


Currently, my solution is to use excitable girl for it, put childish under optimism+lolita combination and squeeze calm optimism somewhere else, but I'm not totally sure about it.
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And another thing that I'm wondering about: I have some ripped lines that would fit for "big sis" archetype (caring, overly-protective and often giving preachings) that I would like to add, but I'm unable to figure what trait to use, or (and I would prefer that) how to name a new one.

May I suggest not to bother with traits for texts at this point? Just base those around occupations, disposition and other relevant stats and we can expand on that later.